Deployment, PTSD, And Mental Health || Benjamin Osgood

[00:00:09] We are live, feeling fine. This is now episode 39. We're moving, we're grooving. I'd like to welcome you all to the next episode of the podcast.

[00:00:55] Welcome back to the show. This is Giants Amongst Us, where we share in the unique human experience and where you're going to hear real stories that are told by real people, the relatable ones, people just like yourself.

[00:01:14] These stories, they come from different places. They come from all walks of life to let you know that it doesn't matter what you've been through. It doesn't matter what your past story says. It doesn't matter where you come from. Change can be had.

[00:01:30] You can shed that old skin. You can break old conditions and you can rewrite old programs and start a new script in life.

[00:01:40] You're limitless. The spirit that lives inside of you is resilient. This is Giants Amongst Us.

[00:01:47] It's about transcending struggles. It's about transcending challenges and circumstances that we're not happy with, that we're not satisfied with, that we're not content with.

[00:01:57] It's about a new way of doing things. It's about a change in attitude. It's about a change in mentality. It's about a change in lifestyle, behaviors, habits.

[00:02:06] That change has to happen inside of you. And with these stories, with these testimonies and examples that you're going to hear from people that have their own unique journey that they've been through.

[00:02:17] How they were able to deal with whatever it was that life threw at them. Taking accountability, not playing that victim card.

[00:02:25] And if they did, not holding on to it. It's time to let that go and take back control.

[00:02:32] Take back responsibility and accountability for who you are and what you are.

[00:02:37] Because that is when change can start to happen.

[00:02:41] Rather than looking for someone outside of us to save us, you need to turn it in and know that you have the power, the tools, and the resources to save yourself.

[00:02:50] So if this is your first time listening to the show, welcome.

[00:02:54] First of all, I'd like to invite you, once you hear this conversation, to go back to the archives.

[00:03:00] Listen to past stories, to past guests, and hear what they have to say.

[00:03:04] Because all of these stories have that commonality about transcending and moving beyond struggle, challenge, handicap, setbacks, and striving in becoming something more.

[00:03:18] It's about change. It's about changing your reality. It's about changing your personality.

[00:03:23] It's about changing the inner dynamics that maybe have been keeping you back and hindering you from growing and evolving and becoming that giant that you are.

[00:03:34] So whenever time permits, after this, check out giantsamongstus.org, giantsamongstus.org.

[00:03:44] And there you can listen to past stories and guests.

[00:03:47] You can find ways to get in touch with them if anything they say strikes a chord with you.

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[00:04:19] So happy Monday to everybody.

[00:04:21] I'm happy to have another sit down to share with you all.

[00:04:24] And today, Benjamin joins us and he's got a story to tell.

[00:04:30] So a bit of a disclaimer, a lot of my upbringing, I have to tell from the point of view of from what I've been told,

[00:04:39] because after 13 years and everything that happened, and I suppose one could say from things that happened in the childhood, I don't directly remember a lot of it.

[00:04:53] Because when I came back from Afghanistan, the reaction when I came back from that deployment was very,

[00:05:00] what happened to you? You used to be so happy.

[00:05:03] Why are you so different? You needed to cheer up, blah, blah, blah.

[00:05:07] I don't remember if I verbalized so much because I'm still recovering at this point from what happened on the deployment.

[00:05:14] I believe I may have actually said it was, I'm sorry.

[00:05:17] I just had a deployment to Afghanistan where seven of my friends have died.

[00:05:23] Many more have been horribly wounded or killed.

[00:05:25] And I have seen and had to deal with things I would rather not have had to ever do in my life.

[00:05:31] And I'm questioning if this is something that any of us should have been involved with.

[00:05:37] Ladies and gentlemen, thank you for checking back with us.

[00:05:42] This is Giants Amongst Us, where we share in a unique human experience.

[00:05:46] And I'm pleased to have another sit down.

[00:05:49] I'm excited about connecting with another guest so he can share some of his walk through life,

[00:05:56] some of his journey, what made him, what almost broke him, what brought him back.

[00:06:00] And where he's at these days.

[00:06:02] So, Benjamin, thank you so much for taking time out of your day.

[00:06:06] You could have been anywhere, could have been doing anything.

[00:06:08] But here we are having a little sit down.

[00:06:11] So welcome aboard.

[00:06:12] How's it going?

[00:06:13] It's doing fantastic.

[00:06:14] And no, it is an absolute pleasure.

[00:06:17] I've loved bits of the show that I've been able to catch up to now.

[00:06:20] And now we were talking earlier before we started recording and you and I almost got sidetracked.

[00:06:25] And I guess it's a good thing we started hitting the record button.

[00:06:28] Otherwise, we would have definitely been running out of time to even start.

[00:06:31] Yeah, that's right.

[00:06:32] Yeah, exactly.

[00:06:33] That's what I get.

[00:06:34] I get caught up sometimes.

[00:06:36] And yeah, we almost got lost in the sauce there.

[00:06:38] But it's yeah, it's only right that we hit the record.

[00:06:43] Easily.

[00:06:44] Well, we know for next time.

[00:06:45] We'll just hit record immediately.

[00:06:47] There you go.

[00:06:48] Yeah.

[00:06:48] Get all of the juice.

[00:06:49] There we are.

[00:06:50] We'll go free for him.

[00:06:51] Right on.

[00:06:52] You know, just for starters, I always like to get a little background on the guests and

[00:06:56] a little little backstory on some of their upbringing, excuse me, and where they come from.

[00:07:02] So you mind sharing, sharing some of that with all of us here today?

[00:07:06] So bit of a disclaimer.

[00:07:08] A lot of my upbringing, I have to tell from the point of view of from what I've been told,

[00:07:17] because after 13 years and everything that happened, and I suppose one could say from

[00:07:24] things that happened in the childhood, I don't directly remember a lot of it.

[00:07:29] So thanks, U.S. Army and, you know, courtesy of whoever was making those rockets in Afghanistan,

[00:07:36] got a couple of brain injuries off of this.

[00:07:39] The childhood wise, a lot of moving, a lot of Air Force stuff all over the U.S.

[00:07:45] I know I was in Germany, I think until I was five.

[00:07:48] Then I was all over the U.S. moving around with the family.

[00:07:51] I did join the military out of Florida, and I do kind of have memories of, say, talking

[00:07:58] with a recruiter.

[00:07:59] And that whole scenario was just I was not happy with who I was, what I was doing, where

[00:08:07] I was going in life.

[00:08:09] 9-11 happened when I was 11.

[00:08:11] And I remember just not quite understanding what it was, what it meant, but just this

[00:08:23] rage, this anger at 11 years old.

[00:08:26] And it being so palpable, like someone had directly affected me.

[00:08:34] Because I did have an uncle that used to work in the North Tower.

[00:08:37] So as fate would have it, he had been fired a couple of days earlier.

[00:08:43] So he wasn't even there anymore and no one knew it.

[00:08:47] Wow.

[00:08:47] So there was some fortune along with the misfortune.

[00:08:53] Then fast forward, I'm senior year in high school and an older friend of mine had joined

[00:08:59] the Marines and he died in Iraq.

[00:09:02] So slowly, as I'm getting into the ages of, say, 17 to 19, I'm starting to lose friends

[00:09:11] very quickly in Iraq.

[00:09:14] So it was kind of inevitable that I was going to start putting a uniform on at an early

[00:09:20] age.

[00:09:21] And dropped out of college after I started failing classes.

[00:09:26] I just wasn't happy anymore.

[00:09:30] And once I got into our recruiter's office, threw my hand up and got shipped to Fort Benning,

[00:09:36] Georgia, things started getting extremely clear.

[00:09:38] I remember the feeling of being on the bus with 50 other people driving through that gate

[00:09:46] and seeing Fort Benning, Georgia, home of the infantry.

[00:09:50] And that being the clearest moment early on in my life.

[00:09:56] And it's almost like that was the first day of my life.

[00:10:01] And it started as a joke.

[00:10:03] I say, oh, that's the first day of my life.

[00:10:06] But the more I've lived, it's it's sort of become true.

[00:10:11] Because I do not have a clear memory before I was 20 years old.

[00:10:17] I cannot tell you a single birthday party I've had as a kid.

[00:10:22] I cannot tell you a single like winter holiday.

[00:10:25] I can't tell you a single family vacation.

[00:10:28] None of it.

[00:10:29] I can't tell you a sports event.

[00:10:31] I can't tell you anything.

[00:10:34] I have vague memories, but I can't tell you any freaking details about it.

[00:10:40] Wow.

[00:10:40] So we're talking about everything in general from the people in your life to the events,

[00:10:48] the activity, everything.

[00:10:50] And in recent times, not even, I would say a month ago, my grandmother wound up in the hospital.

[00:10:58] So, of course, me and my wife went to go and see her.

[00:11:02] She's doing okay now.

[00:11:03] They did release her.

[00:11:05] But while we were there, we took the opportunity to reconnect and everything else.

[00:11:09] And she wasn't too sure how things were going to turn.

[00:11:13] And the conversation got a little serious.

[00:11:16] And at first she said, well, we need to talk.

[00:11:19] I knew that tone.

[00:11:21] I've always been extremely close with my grandmother.

[00:11:24] This is my mother's mother.

[00:11:27] And we spoke.

[00:11:30] And at first it said, well, it's just going to be us.

[00:11:33] I said, no, anything you can say to me, you can say to my wife.

[00:11:35] She said, I agree.

[00:11:37] We'll go for it.

[00:11:38] And the more she spoke about the relationship in between myself and my parents,

[00:11:44] the more it started to make sense as to why I didn't remember my childhood.

[00:11:48] And every just hint as to why it felt like I didn't want to have that close of an interpersonal connection with them.

[00:11:56] And I'll summarize by saying there is a very fine difference in between being a parent and being someone who has had a child.

[00:12:06] So, yeah, that was one in particular.

[00:12:11] According to my grandmother, I was maybe 13.

[00:12:14] Went on a golf outing during a Thanksgiving holiday when I was visiting them in Georgia.

[00:12:19] I messed up a golf shot.

[00:12:21] And my father spent about an hour and a half screaming, yelling, and berating at me about not listening to him on how to swing a golf club.

[00:12:30] My grandmother's brother came back and said some very harsh words about my father.

[00:12:39] And that he was a horrible human being, in summary.

[00:12:44] My grandmother couldn't agree more.

[00:12:47] Because apparently the only reason he was even allowed near the rest of the family was because he treated my mother decently and did not hit her.

[00:12:56] Now, I have no memories of any kind of like physical abuse.

[00:13:03] Maybe.

[00:13:03] Allegedly.

[00:13:04] Who knows?

[00:13:05] I have no clue.

[00:13:06] So, you're pretty much just left at the mercy of what people are telling you or say your grandmother and that to be true.

[00:13:14] Not to say that she would lie to you.

[00:13:16] But, I mean, you're just left at the mercy of what people are telling you.

[00:13:19] And you don't know whether or not it actually happened or didn't happen.

[00:13:23] Let's just say.

[00:13:24] Right.

[00:13:25] Makes a lot of sense, though.

[00:13:27] Yeah.

[00:13:28] Looking at his personality and looking at how he acts now and everything just kind of falls into place.

[00:13:34] Especially, you know, you have those gut feelings when you're interacting with someone and you just kind of there's that little hint of I don't know if I should be listening to this person.

[00:13:43] Or when someone calls you on the phone or sends you a text, you get that gut feeling of, oh, God, they're calling or a text from them.

[00:13:51] It is constant.

[00:13:53] Were you the only child?

[00:13:55] No, I have a younger sister.

[00:13:57] They dote on her.

[00:13:58] Last I know.

[00:13:59] I have no idea.

[00:14:00] I have not had direct contact with either of them or my sister or anything since 2013.

[00:14:08] Okay.

[00:14:09] That's been a long time.

[00:14:10] And it was by choice, correct?

[00:14:12] You cut him off?

[00:14:13] Oh, that was 100% by choice.

[00:14:15] Because when I came back from Afghanistan, the reaction when I came back from that deployment was very, what happened to you?

[00:14:23] You used to be so happy.

[00:14:25] Why are you so different?

[00:14:26] You need to cheer up, blah, blah, blah.

[00:14:29] To which I don't remember if I verbalized so much because I'm still recovering at this point from what happened on the deployment said.

[00:14:39] But I believe I may have actually said it was, I'm sorry.

[00:14:42] I just had a deployment to Afghanistan where seven of my friends have died.

[00:14:50] Many more have been horribly wounded or killed.

[00:14:54] And I have seen and had to deal with things I would rather not have had to ever do in my life.

[00:15:00] And I'm questioning if this is something that any of us should have been involved with.

[00:15:08] And at the same time, I want to go back because I do not want to be in the country anymore.

[00:15:14] Wow, that's a really torn feeling inside.

[00:15:18] It really was because I'm coming back to the United States and it was, you know, a lot of veterans have this same feeling.

[00:15:26] You felt more at home in another country getting shot at every single day than you did here in the U.S.

[00:15:34] And you felt horrible about it.

[00:15:37] I know I did.

[00:15:38] Yeah.

[00:15:38] For that first deployment that you had, how long were you out?

[00:15:42] That was 11 months.

[00:15:44] How was you?

[00:15:45] Can you still remember how it was for you?

[00:15:48] The emotions or what you were feeling?

[00:15:50] Oh, yeah.

[00:15:50] Oh, yeah.

[00:15:51] I remember.

[00:15:52] I remember the first day.

[00:15:56] Oh, God.

[00:15:58] First day.

[00:16:00] We so airplane in land, get onto the Chinook with everyone else, get onto the Chinook, fly out, fly out to the landing zone, get onto Black Hawk.

[00:16:10] Black Hawk takes us to the secondary, secondary land, refill Black Hawk.

[00:16:14] And then from that secondary zone on Orgun, from Orgun, get onto the Black Hawk that just got refilled.

[00:16:23] And it was myself and three or four other people.

[00:16:27] We get onto the Black Hawk and we start flying over to Boris.

[00:16:31] Bob Boris is a very southeast part of Afghanistan.

[00:16:36] And it was far.

[00:16:37] So first time I've ever flying in a Black Hawk in a combat zone, I think I was 21 at the time.

[00:16:47] Fresh 21.

[00:16:49] And we're flying out and all of a sudden I look up and I see the crew chief starts wrapping his hands in the cargo nets.

[00:17:00] He's sitting up closer to the pilots looking at us.

[00:17:03] Next to me, my corporal starts grabbing his belt straps and starts cinching it down as tightly as he can.

[00:17:12] And I'm looking at him trying to think, I wonder what he's doing.

[00:17:15] And right as the thought crossed my head that that's a seatbelt, I'm looking around going, I didn't know helicopters had seatbelts.

[00:17:23] Why would he need a seatbelt?

[00:17:24] Well, the helicopter dropped about 500 feet straight down because the pilot dove straight down into a riverbank.

[00:17:34] So I'm guessing at this point, this is where he was getting shot at all the time.

[00:17:38] So he went low to the deck and he started Vietnam type stuff all the way through.

[00:17:45] He already knew.

[00:17:47] He already knew the protocol.

[00:17:48] And it was your first day on the job.

[00:17:50] Yeah, I went, oh, God.

[00:17:53] Oh, man.

[00:17:55] Worst roller coaster I've ever been on.

[00:17:57] Did you have all those, the fear, the anxiety, the butterflies?

[00:18:02] Did you have all or you just were locked in on the mission?

[00:18:05] Oh, I got caught in once he leveled out and I could see the fob.

[00:18:12] And it was rushing through so much.

[00:18:14] I went, did we just get shot down?

[00:18:15] Are we rushing?

[00:18:16] Is he fucking with us?

[00:18:17] Everything was just quick, quick, quick, quick, quick.

[00:18:21] Because I was still trying to find the seatbelt the whole time.

[00:18:26] The whole time he's rushing through, all my brain is still caught on.

[00:18:29] I wonder where the seatbelt is.

[00:18:31] Right.

[00:18:32] And just weaving in through.

[00:18:34] Corporal Klein was having a great time probably watching my dumb ass try to secure myself.

[00:18:40] I'm just glad I didn't fly out the door.

[00:18:43] Oh, yeah.

[00:18:43] He was probably.

[00:18:44] He was having a good time.

[00:18:46] He was a good leader.

[00:18:46] He was really good.

[00:18:47] He was like a big brother.

[00:18:49] Actually, he's probably more like a dad, really.

[00:18:51] He probably could have been my dad.

[00:18:52] He was 38, I want to say.

[00:18:56] He could have easily.

[00:18:57] He could have easily been my dad.

[00:18:59] I think he was from Robinson Central.

[00:19:01] Not his first deployment either.

[00:19:02] Oh, God, no.

[00:19:02] He was a Marine for five years before his wife said he needed to do something safer.

[00:19:08] Yeah.

[00:19:09] He had two deployments as a Marine and six deployments in the Army.

[00:19:12] And I remember, I thought maybe I heard it wrong, but I thought with the rotations, like

[00:19:18] say if you were sent out one time, because from my understanding, you had multiple deployments,

[00:19:23] but for the longest, I always thought it was just one deployment and you were supposed

[00:19:28] to have a good break or you weren't supposed to do consecutive ones.

[00:19:33] But that turns out to be quite the opposite.

[00:19:37] I don't know.

[00:19:37] Was that how it?

[00:19:38] An official policy.

[00:19:39] Yeah.

[00:19:40] An official policy.

[00:19:41] Yeah, it was.

[00:19:42] But that's if you're staying in the same battalion.

[00:19:45] Because the battalions were rotating.

[00:19:48] There was no way for them to say, oh, well, this individual had a deployment this date,

[00:19:53] this time for this long.

[00:19:54] So we're not going to deploy them.

[00:19:56] But it's a lot easier to control which battalions are going to go.

[00:20:00] So, for example, the battalion I deployed with to Afghanistan, they had come back from Africa

[00:20:06] in 2010.

[00:20:07] They didn't deploy to Afghanistan until 2012.

[00:20:11] So they had a two year break in between deployments.

[00:20:14] Now, there were individuals that had just deployed to Afghanistan and came back in 2011.

[00:20:22] And then they got reassigned to my battalion in the beginning of 2012 and deployed in the

[00:20:28] beginning of 2012.

[00:20:30] So they had maybe five months in between coming back from Afghanistan and going right back to

[00:20:36] Afghanistan.

[00:20:38] And that happened often, especially with people that were first sergeants or higher.

[00:20:44] I think there was a report that came out in 2017 or 18.

[00:20:52] I remember reading when I was at Fort San Antonio, they were talking about psychological evaluations

[00:20:59] of senior leaders.

[00:21:00] They pooled, I think, 100 people across the different branches.

[00:21:08] So 100 Marines, 100 Army, 100 Navy, so on, of Sergeant Major and equivalent.

[00:21:14] And one of the biggest things that they brought up was senior leaders being deployed for 90%

[00:21:23] of their careers starting in 2003 was one of the big contributing factors of psychological

[00:21:29] retention rates being so problematic.

[00:21:33] Man.

[00:21:33] Man.

[00:21:34] Man.

[00:21:42] Man.

[00:21:44] Man.

[00:22:01] Man.

[00:22:03] be in long enough to do the job. Exactly. So it's, it's really hard to look at them and say,

[00:22:11] Sergeant Major, I know you've been in country for eight years of your 10 year career,

[00:22:19] since you were a private. However, you're gonna have to go back.

[00:22:24] Because there's no choice. There's no one else. How long were you in before you first were deployed?

[00:22:30] So I graduated OSIT in 2011. And deployed in a couple years, March of 2012. So probably a little

[00:22:41] a little over a year. So probably 1314 months. But I think I got more training in the eight to nine

[00:22:50] months right before the deployment than any other time. They wanted to make sure there was definitely

[00:22:55] a sense of if we're taking the boots, we're taking the green guys, they're going to be ready.

[00:23:03] So when by the time it came to go on the bus, it was just calm. Getting onto the plane still in country,

[00:23:12] you know, to go to Afghanistan, it was just ready. It felt like getting on the bus to go to the

[00:23:18] homecoming game. It was just, we're ready. It was just finally, all the hard work is about to get put

[00:23:24] to the test. And even, you know, when that Black Hawk was landing at Boris, that very first day that

[00:23:30] I was there, and I was hopping off, there were just people yelling and waving. So I start, you know,

[00:23:35] running. Well, the Black Hawk took off immediately because a rocket came screaming in and blew up in the

[00:23:39] landing zone. So I'm in the country five minutes, and I'm already getting shot at. And that didn't

[00:23:45] register until maybe later that day, just how ironic that was. I've been here five minutes.

[00:23:51] Welcome to Afghanistan. And I honestly didn't care. Sadly, a big part of me there was thinking about

[00:24:00] a bunch of my high school friends that came home in pine boxes.

[00:24:06] So it was like a V for Vendetta.

[00:24:08] No, it was, I'm going to meet my friends. I didn't expect to come home. It was, I'm going to,

[00:24:15] I'm going to go do my part. I didn't have a girlfriend. I didn't have a fiance. I wasn't

[00:24:23] close with my family even then, really. I didn't really have a place. I didn't have a career to look

[00:24:32] forward to in a civilian sector. So I said, well, if I'm going to, you know, die, then

[00:24:39] I don't want to commit. This is how, this is how depressed I was. I didn't want to commit suicide

[00:24:46] because I felt that was just selfish. I felt if I'm going to die, I'll make it a good death.

[00:24:55] I will go and fight and not purposely put myself in the harm's way, but I will go and fight until

[00:25:06] I die. And I honestly planned to stay deployed or do anything I could to stay in combat zones

[00:25:16] until I was dead. That sounds like a suicide mission. It really was. Was I some Rambo super

[00:25:26] tough, like SF guy? No, I was a regular grunt. I was worse than an 11 Bravo. I was a mortar. I was an

[00:25:34] 11 Chuck. I was around explosives. And don't they call the grunts, the bullet catchers? Oh yes.

[00:25:40] I was, I was, well, I was a smart grunt. I was an 11 Bravo that could do some math. Really? That

[00:25:47] was really it. So I'm walking around with a mortar, like a 60 millimeter mortar strap to me,

[00:25:54] a bunch of grenades on me. I've got 60 millimeter mortars in my bag. I've got,

[00:26:01] uh, at one point I had a grenade launcher on my, like I was loaded.

[00:26:08] You're the 4th of July in, in flesh. Oh God. No one wanted to walk around me. It was great.

[00:26:15] And I think it took me four or five months in that country to kind of start looking at everything

[00:26:24] outside of this really foggy haze, uh, probably less like three months maybe. And I started to

[00:26:32] really just kind of pay attention and look at that country, not as a potential graveyard,

[00:26:38] but I started remembering books I had read when I would just sit alone in the barracks.

[00:26:46] Um, one of them was a book by a Cambridge professor in the eighties. And it was the graveyard of nations,

[00:26:56] a book on Afghanistan. And there was mention of Alexander the great when he marched through that

[00:27:04] place. And I started looking around cause he marched through that same area. And the funniest thing

[00:27:12] happened when I started thinking about it down in this riverbed where we were patrolling,

[00:27:17] there was this large termite hill looking thing. And we were walking right up to it. And as we got

[00:27:26] closer, I saw little carvings on the bottom of it. So me and another guy walked up to it with our

[00:27:34] interpreter. And sure enough, it was Macedonian writing on the bottom. It was a watchtower.

[00:27:42] Alexander the great's army had put up in Afghanistan. And there was just, I can't read it,

[00:27:51] but there were pictures around it and everything else. And it just kind of showed

[00:27:55] the same imagery that soldiers nowadays put on the inside of Porter John's, you know, very graphic.

[00:28:03] And I'm laughing going, my God, soldiers have never changed. And we're just laughing at pointing

[00:28:09] at all this. That's like a, almost a reminder. There's nothing new under the sun.

[00:28:15] Never. So it kind of made me think about how many, how many of these guys didn't want to come here?

[00:28:22] How many of these guys wanted to come here? What, how human were they? To many of us,

[00:28:29] these historical figures are gods, but there were so many that were with these historical figures that

[00:28:39] we revere that are nameless and remain nameless to history that were real men and women, real sons

[00:28:46] and daughters, real fathers and mothers that lived lives and were just the same as you and me.

[00:28:53] And that kind of had me thinking. And that was all the way back in 2012. And I don't know that watch

[00:29:03] tower sparked this idea, this fantastic idea in my head. And it shot off in all these other little

[00:29:12] directions where I started imagining scenarios where it's like a one, one, I like to joke around with my

[00:29:21] buddies is imagine what it was like to be George Washington's quartermaster and, uh, having to,

[00:29:29] to deal with his crap. You just have a report and say, George Washington, sir. Uh, this is the eighth

[00:29:35] horse I've had to requisition for you today. Can, can we put you on a horse that's not white or gray?

[00:29:41] You keep getting them shot. I have a really nice black one right here. Okay. This is getting

[00:29:47] expensive, please. George Washington's just, but I don't look good on a black horse, sir. I give two

[00:29:53] shits. You're getting on the, you're getting on the black one, but the, the painter, what painter?

[00:29:58] What, what do you mean painter? Well, I have a personal painter that comes with me and paints all my

[00:30:02] portraits. What portraits? Why do you need portraits? Well, I'm going to be president. What the hell's a

[00:30:06] president? You know what? Nevermind. I'll get you another gray horse. Shut up. And then a few months

[00:30:11] later, sir, please sit down in the boat. And who's this guy on the river bank? Why is he painting

[00:30:16] shit? Yeah. Yeah. And just like funny little things in my head. Who, who, who were these nameless

[00:30:23] people that have seen history and had no idea that they were witnessing it and just the, those ideas.

[00:30:29] And then of course that all stemmed into what later became, uh, what are the makings of my fantasy

[00:30:36] series that I'm in the middle of writing. And when I started really getting deep into the weeds of

[00:30:42] writing it all these years later, that's been a very big source of comfort and therapy to just

[00:30:49] explore trauma, explore, uh, psychology and to get over a lot of the things that I've dealt with. Uh,

[00:30:59] like if anyone reads the first book, there are some very dark and disturbing and graphic

[00:31:06] images that are in that book that when I was thinking back and describing these things,

[00:31:14] they're based on events and experiences that I had to deal with personally wounds that I had to help

[00:31:25] people with or memories that I personally have had other issues that me and my friends deal with on,

[00:31:34] if not consistently on a daily or hourly basis. I mean, today, not even kidding you today,

[00:31:42] I have had for maybe years, an alarm on my phone to wake up. It's called, uh, it's a Spotify playlist

[00:31:53] called relaxing and calming bird sounds. Okay. I woke up early, was making coffee.

[00:32:01] The alarm goes off and my phone was not near me. And I had a PTSD attack because I thought that bloody

[00:32:08] bluebird noises were rocket attacks. So I can no longer use that alarm anymore because bluebirds

[00:32:16] trigger my damn PTSD. Great. That is awesome. That's fantastic. But yeah, not to get off subject with

[00:32:24] that, but just the PTSD, it seems that, you know, there, there are rightful cases. I'm not,

[00:32:32] I'm not downplaying and who am I anyways to say, no, you have it or you don't have it. But it seems like

[00:32:38] there's a lot of, there's a lot of people that are saying they have PTSD. And I guess everybody is

[00:32:46] affected in different ways by, uh, let's say loss or grief. But now when you're in the war zone,

[00:32:52] this is something that's completely different, but, um, yeah, it seems like I, I hear that word be,

[00:32:58] or I hear those letters being thrown around an awful lot these days.

[00:33:03] I've been talking with a lot of, I just had a, another interview recently with, uh, I apologize.

[00:33:11] That was a phone call from Idaho. I had a collectors talk. I had a interview recently with, uh, the forensic

[00:33:21] nurse files podcast. Uh, their hosts deal with patients that are dealing with psychological trauma,

[00:33:28] emotional trauma, physical trauma, mostly stemming from sexual based assault. Uh, and a lot of their

[00:33:36] listeners are, uh, they're predominantly female, but they do also deal with cases involving male

[00:33:44] victims in their professional, cause they're still nurses. And when I was getting out of the military

[00:33:50] and I had left the combat arms community, I had moved into the medical field at the end of my military

[00:33:56] career. So I got to also see the, you know, not just the, the before effect of combat, but the after.

[00:34:05] So that when I left, you know, pulling the trigger, then I moved into a field where maybe I can do some

[00:34:15] good. And that for me, just opened my eyes to a lot of stuff that happens at the tail end.

[00:34:22] And there is a lot of confusion, I would say, and disagreement on multiple trains of thought

[00:34:32] in the mental health community when it comes to disorders of just traumatic disorders in general,

[00:34:41] you have PTSD, CPTSD, postpartum depressive disorder. They want everyone wants to put a label on it,

[00:34:53] but I think the, the best way I have heard it vocalized or described right now is no matter what

[00:35:03] label you put onto it, whether, you know, CPTSD or PTSD, you can generalize it how you like it just to

[00:35:12] try and put some comfort onto a name. So you can identify that you do have it. So long as you use it

[00:35:19] as a crutch, you're never going to recover from it. But if you acknowledge it and go, yeah, I do,

[00:35:26] but it is not my defining factor. Then there is a very good chance. I would say a 90% chance

[00:35:34] in my opinion that you can live a normal, healthy life and you can improve yourself.

[00:35:42] For me, as soon as I acknowledged, I had an issue is I don't, I refuse to call mine a problem because

[00:35:52] when I was calling it a problem, things got worse for me. And I found myself going deeper into a

[00:35:58] hole. But as soon as I just started acknowledging it more as an issue that I just have to find new ways

[00:36:04] to deal with it or work around it, then things started to get a little easier. IE don't use

[00:36:12] certain ringtones to wake up in the morning. Or there are certain behaviors that I follow that

[00:36:21] may seem strange to other people, but they're comforting to me. So I do it anyway. Like

[00:36:29] I don't go into crowded restaurants or if I go to a crowded restaurant, cause I hardly ever do.

[00:36:36] I don't sit in the middle of a restaurant with my back to a door.

[00:36:41] And quite honestly, if I were to say this to anyone, I wouldn't recommend that anyone sit in

[00:36:48] the middle of a restaurant with their back to a door. Even if you weren't in a combat zone or have

[00:36:54] PTSD. I don't personally believe that restaurants should be designed that way anymore. Period. For

[00:37:00] anybody. Unless it's a waffle house, because you've got staff at waffle house that would probably take,

[00:37:07] take on army Rangers and win. So I think the safest restaurant you could ever be in is a waffle house.

[00:37:14] Yeah, that that's a very good point. I think is, is worth emphasizing the fact that everybody has had

[00:37:21] their, their own experiences in life. And some people they've been traumatized in a lot of different

[00:37:26] ways, sexual abuse through combat, through loss. And, um, even with a disorder or with a handicap or

[00:37:34] whatever it is, but if you're to not use that as a crutch or to not let that define you, because then

[00:37:42] you are ultimately giving away your power. You're giving away your ability to be able to try to

[00:37:49] work towards any kind of recovery or healing. And I liked the way that, um, you put it in saying that

[00:37:55] that wasn't the case for you and you were doing things to try to, you're, you weren't seeing it as a

[00:38:02] problem, but you were in your own way, trying to cope with it, trying to get well and, um, trying to

[00:38:08] sort out the madness that was going on inside of you. But it didn't start out that way. I honestly,

[00:38:14] for a very long time, I've refused to acknowledge there even was a problem.

[00:38:18] Yeah. Can you talk about that? How, like, were you just suppressing it, bypassing it?

[00:38:24] I wasn't even acknowledging it. It was more, uh, came back. So come back from deployment in 2013.

[00:38:31] I remember coming in through building and they were doing all the questionnaires,

[00:38:35] stuff like one of the dumbest questions these people ask.

[00:38:38] Is it like a psychiatric evaluation?

[00:38:40] Oh, it was full blown. It was a psychiatric medical regional. Like one of the questions was,

[00:38:46] and it's all civilians to, uh, civilians that are working for the DOD. Some of them were former

[00:38:53] military. Some are not no idea who these people work for. But one of the questions was,

[00:38:56] did you just come from a combat zone? And we're all looking at these people going, it's Afghanistan.

[00:39:03] Yes. Yes, we did. Oh, okay. Well, please go over to this line. So of course,

[00:39:07] every single person coming off of this plane went to that zone and they're looking surprised,

[00:39:13] like, Oh my goodness. Yeah. It's Afghanistan. So this was a dumb question. The next few,

[00:39:19] uh, other. So, uh, well, I remember another question was, uh, at, did any point were you exposed

[00:39:26] to blood or bodily fluids of a local national during your time in this combat zone?

[00:39:32] And I remember the look on this poor woman's face when I laughed at her and said, yeah,

[00:39:40] of course. And the, she was horrified. I'm just like, what are you, what, what's the issue?

[00:39:49] Yes, of course I was because in my mind it was the obvious answer because to me, I was thinking

[00:39:55] every single person you have talked to has said yes, apparently no. So then I had to go and get

[00:40:02] like a ton of blood screening for every blood disease known to man. That was fantastic. I'm glad I don't

[00:40:10] have a fear of needles. Then the big one, the, do you believe you have PTSD or are suffering from PTSD

[00:40:17] or have trauma and other things? I said, no, which of course meant to them that I did.

[00:40:27] So they took me and 50 or 60 other people into a room and had us fill out a three or four page,

[00:40:35] very intense, very boring psych eval. Now, of course I told the truth, which meant I got to go and take

[00:40:44] another test. And of course I told the truth, which meant I got to go and sit in our room with a person,

[00:40:51] which of course I told the truth. And the entire time I'm refusing to say no, or refusing to say,

[00:40:57] yes, I have, I have an issue. Yeah. I'm telling the truth and I'm justifying every single thing.

[00:41:02] Things like doing loud noises, get a startle you. And I said, of course they startled me.

[00:41:09] Loud noises, startle everyone. No, I mean, does your heart race? Yeah. It was a loud noise.

[00:41:14] Well, what goes through your mind when you hear a loud noise? I don't know. What calms you down?

[00:41:20] Knowing exactly where the noise was, what the noise is, who made the noise, what is happening

[00:41:26] because of the noise, getting legitimately 100% of the detail, who, what, when, where, how,

[00:41:32] where am I doing? Do you feel safer if you are armed? Yes, everyone does. Not even thinking that

[00:41:41] the underlying question to that is, or the underlying knowledge, I should say, a person who is not armed

[00:41:49] 100% of the time and is in constant fear may be suffering or may feel this way because they might

[00:41:59] have suffered such like sudden trauma, be it sexual, physical, emotional combat related,

[00:42:04] because many people who have gone through such trauma immediately go into this state of,

[00:42:09] I must be armed at all times because I will not have that power taken from me ever again,

[00:42:16] or I will not be put in danger ever again. Now, people have 100% the right to defend themselves.

[00:42:24] It is a God-given right. Definitely. For me, I do have means of protecting myself. However, because of events

[00:42:35] on my end, I do not carry anymore. Because thank goodness, I got stopped by my wife, because my God,

[00:42:47] I did not want to be a news story at 7pm. So I know, personally for me, that it's not safe for me

[00:42:57] to carry. And that I'm glad I've acknowledged that. Very. However, should one decide to fuck around

[00:43:07] and find out, they shall. Yeah. We're talking about our livelihoods, our family livelihoods,

[00:43:13] and I think any rightful man, or even woman for that matter, let's just say, you know, they're

[00:43:18] going to defend theirs. Oh, yeah. And they should. Because it's the other part of, like you said,

[00:43:24] that feeling of helplessness, that feeling of the loss of control. And there's nothing that,

[00:43:30] the other part of it is, especially in the medical side of things, the term victim is

[00:43:38] not something that you like to use when dealing with someone that has come in, and they have

[00:43:44] suffered an issue. So what we try to do, when I was working actively, and we were helping folks that

[00:43:52] had come in seeking assistance, is we try to avoid using the word as much as possible.

[00:43:59] And you never, you never come in and do the, the woe is you, we're so sorry, because that drives them

[00:44:07] deeper and deeper. What I found from, for me in a lot of cases, was people that are coming fresh off

[00:44:14] of it, especially when it came to sexual assault victims, was reiterate the fact that you are not at

[00:44:24] fault. You had nothing to do with this, you are going to come back stronger, you have the ability

[00:44:33] to make sure that this never happens to yourself ever again. You are not responsible for their

[00:44:38] actions. You did nothing to deserve this. And you're not a victim at all. This is unfortunate.

[00:44:46] And this is horrible. And we're going to do everything we can to help you. But this is not over. And you're

[00:44:51] going to fight, you're going to win. I would treat it as much as you would treat someone that is

[00:44:57] suffering from cancer. Because as soon as you give someone hope, and you give them that chance to push

[00:45:04] forward, to reach out and grab a hold, they're going to pull themselves up. And it's, it's incredible

[00:45:11] to watch. You can see people claw their way out of the deepest, darkest hole with nothing but willpower.

[00:45:18] Yes, the human spirit is resilient. That sounds like what you're doing there is you're empowering

[00:45:25] these individuals to find the resources and the inner grit to come out of it themselves. With a

[00:45:33] little push. We all need that push and that lifeline sometimes, but that's all it takes. And you watch

[00:45:39] them really, really, like you said, work themselves out of a ditch, a hole, a black, meaningless pit. And yeah,

[00:45:50] they can do some extraordinary things. Let's just say. You and I, you and I know better than most. I

[00:45:55] mean, how many times that we see, use the perfect example, you and I, we both, everyone who's gone through

[00:46:01] basic training or any kind of team, sports, military law enforcement, whatever, there was always been

[00:46:08] that one really heavy set guy that just wasn't. But when there was that moment, where he did something

[00:46:17] physically incredible, whether it was lifting something huge, or running faster, or beating the

[00:46:26] crap out of someone, there was always that one, the really, really big guy, or the very small four foot

[00:46:35] one guy from Pekipski, or, you know, there's always those outlier people that you would look at and judge

[00:46:45] and say, there's no way. And they can just do something amazing because they want to. That's right.

[00:46:51] Sheer willpower. That's all really, that's all you need. You just need to want to do it.

[00:46:55] Yeah, that's the fact. So, and that's something that really drove it. So,

[00:47:01] you mentioned writing the book. So, Bart, the swordsman who is one of the protagonists I featured

[00:47:10] in this first book, Hero of Aurea, is a mercenary who has got some issues. He does have PTSD, but

[00:47:21] I did not make this a defining feature. That's something I absolutely hate. I don't like books

[00:47:28] that are, you would call it like just trauma dump books, where every other sentence is,

[00:47:36] oh, I have depression, I have depression, I'm sad, I'm depressed. I don't like that. That's, I'm sorry.

[00:47:41] And how I've been around those type of people as well. And that's just like, in a way, it's,

[00:47:46] I don't know about other people, how they feel, but to me that, for one, it gets on your nerves to

[00:47:52] keep hearing something like that. But then another thing, it just drains like the whole life.

[00:47:57] Yeah. It's like an emotional vampire.

[00:47:59] The energy.

[00:48:00] But they feel better.

[00:48:01] Yes. Yes, exactly. They do. And they're draining the hell out of you.

[00:48:06] They think they feel better because they're getting it off their chest. No, I think they're

[00:48:08] emotional vampires. I think they're just sucking the will,

[00:48:10] your willpower and consuming him like what we do in the shadows. You ever see that show?

[00:48:16] Check that out. There's a guy that literally, he, he's a quote,

[00:48:21] emotional vampire or something like that.

[00:48:23] Woe is me.

[00:48:24] Yeah. He, he just makes people depressed really. And when they get depressed and lose the will to

[00:48:30] live, he feels stronger. I swear. I went, man, maybe that's what real vampires, maybe that's what

[00:48:36] vampires really are. It's just people that make us miserable.

[00:48:39] Yeah. They emotionally dump all of the baggage onto you in a, in a way, I guess that does make

[00:48:47] them feel a little lighter about things.

[00:48:49] Exactly.

[00:48:50] At your expense.

[00:48:51] Yeah. Maybe that's, maybe that's where the real ones are. And they made the whole drinking

[00:48:55] blood thing to cover their tracks. That's the real myth. Vampires exist. We've solved it.

[00:49:02] They do. Yeah.

[00:49:05] But no, crack the case. Yes. Uh, call me history, history channel. Call me. I got you.

[00:49:11] I'll, I'll charge, I'll charge you a case of beer and a bag of Doritos.

[00:49:14] Okay. That's a cheap date. I'm really easy. I'm really easy. I'll even do my own editing,

[00:49:20] but yes. So you were talking about the character or people that emotionally.

[00:49:25] Oh yes. So he's, he's, he has just, I wanted him to be just someone anyone would know. So I don't

[00:49:34] even, I don't even give a lot of physical descriptions to him. I make him not generic,

[00:49:40] but I give enough where you have a vague idea to lean you toward someone that you would know.

[00:49:46] I would, I want people to read him or read this character and have someone in mind and fill in the

[00:49:55] gaps so that they feel they knew him is that was my goal with this character. And when it comes into

[00:50:05] the whole point of him dealing with the PTSD, it's more akin to what myself and many others have,

[00:50:13] where he is having the issues and he's acknowledged. Yeah, it's happened. I'm dealing with it. I'll be

[00:50:20] all right. And he's gotten to the point of, he understands what things are like. He has moved on,

[00:50:28] but he is still moved into a career that only exacerbates the trauma. He's a mercenary where he

[00:50:38] has those memories of when he was a young child and that first time he was on a battlefield and he

[00:50:45] just saw death and destruction. There was blood bodies mutilated. And he was a young child as a

[00:50:52] squire to a night and just this horror that was thrown on him. But now, and in the opening chapter,

[00:51:01] he even muses on this, he goes, man, when I was a kid, the idea of killing and murder and death, all this

[00:51:08] like disgusted me. But now, I mean, you pay me enough. Sure, I'll do it. So it's just kind of become this

[00:51:17] habit. It's just something he does. But the longer he's in this career, the worse it's getting for him, because

[00:51:25] every time he's going out and doing this job, it's prolonging this trauma that he's having to deal with

[00:51:31] every single night when he's having flashbacks or whatever. But more than that, I'm exploring how his

[00:51:39] companions, how his lover is dealing with this, this mage. And she, she has this power, she has these

[00:51:50] abilities. But at the same time, there's nothing she can do. And that kind of reflects to the idea of

[00:51:59] we have people in our lives where in our own ways, we feel I can do anything. You know, I can fix an

[00:52:08] engine, I can fix the plumbing, I can change a tire, I can read this, I can do that, I can learn all this

[00:52:17] stuff to try and help people. But then when I go to these people, and they have this issue, why can't

[00:52:23] I fix them? Why can't I do anything? Why am I so helpless? So it's not frustration, it's this

[00:52:31] hopelessness of being outside of someone with these issues, and not being able to do anything about it,

[00:52:38] even though you know what the issue is. But you can't put a grasp on to how am I going to fix this.

[00:52:45] And you have to just slowly watch them fall apart. And they don't even know it, they're not

[00:52:50] acknowledging it. And you have to just stand there. But that's just kind of a background

[00:52:58] intrapersonal element in between two characters. Because the entire story itself is more of a

[00:53:06] the hero's adventure with grandeur. You know, there's an evil sorceress, there's a threat of

[00:53:14] invasion from a warband on the other side of a barren landscape. There's a mystery of a newly

[00:53:23] discovered evidence that the former queen had been murdered. The king has gotten so depressed that he

[00:53:31] has decided he will abdicate the throne, because he has just learned that his newly found assassinated

[00:53:38] queen actually had a son before she died. And he wants the son found so he can hand over the crown,

[00:53:44] and he can just retire. His two cousins are vying for the crown because they believe that the prince

[00:53:52] is a myth. There's political intrigue, magic, assassination. If you like fantasy, that's a little

[00:54:00] more steeped in reality, especially if you've seen things like Harry Potter, and you look at it and go,

[00:54:06] wow, magic just solves everything. Imagine if you will, magic had a very real cost. And there were

[00:54:13] extreme limitations. If magic was, say, more scientific with it, like it's raining out fire is not a viable

[00:54:22] option. Or if you've ever played the tabletop role playing game Dungeons and Dragons. Yeah,

[00:54:29] yeah, there's I have, I've played Dungeons and Dragons therapeutically for years. So

[00:54:39] therapeutically, therapeutically, it is very helpful. If you want to if you want to get rid of your trauma

[00:54:44] and get a escape from reality for a couple of hours with some friends. Oh, yeah. Dungeons and

[00:54:52] Dragons, any tabletop role playing game, I highly encourage it. Yeah. And it sounds like for you,

[00:54:57] how did this whole process come to be with you writing a book? Because it because it sounds like

[00:55:03] you put a lot of time, thought, energy into these characters. How long was that process overall?

[00:55:10] So do you remember that Watchtower in 2012? Yeah. Started way back then.

[00:55:18] Well, now we're talking about where you started to see these engravings.

[00:55:23] You know, I'm curious, speaking of that, just out of curiosity, because especially where you were at,

[00:55:29] this was a highly concentrated area with a lot of activity, a lot of history. And I'm asking you this,

[00:55:37] because I've been to a few places and visited, let's just say in Greece, you have the amphitheater,

[00:55:43] gorgeous. You have the Colosseum. And so you have this concentration of energy. And for me and my

[00:55:51] wife as well, a few of those places, when you walk there, you stand on it. Oh, yeah. There's a

[00:55:58] presence. There's something strong. There's no denying. Even one in the amphitheater in Greece,

[00:56:05] we were in Krita, in Ritimno. I might be saying it wrong, but standing, just standing in the middle

[00:56:14] of that amphitheater. And there was like a huge presence that it was, it was undeniable. I felt

[00:56:23] it. My wife felt it. And she actually kind of pulled away from it. She was like, this is a little too

[00:56:29] heavy. Or even in Turkey, there was another in boardroom. We went to one of the, there was an

[00:56:37] auditorium that was off the side of the road right there. And I think it was there where she felt it.

[00:56:42] And it was real heavy, both of us. But I'm saying all that to ask you if in any of those places,

[00:56:49] did you feel this high concentration of energy or something of the like?

[00:56:56] When I was near that watchtower, it was, I could almost feel boots marching on that road.

[00:57:03] No joke. It was fantastic because I could, I could remember the legends where I believe I remember the

[00:57:12] stories correctly. When Alexander marched his army east to Afghanistan, it would take his army three

[00:57:18] days and four nights to march from whence a stone had been dropped from the front of the army to pass that

[00:57:25] stone and the rear to do the same. His army was massive. And the ground would tremble when he walked,

[00:57:33] the rivers would run dry, and the grass would weld from the hunger of horses. Just the sheer manpower

[00:57:41] that man had under his control to go after India. And just standing at that tower, just, they would have

[00:57:49] to build these things just to make sure that the line was not going to get ambushed. Because even back

[00:57:54] then, the local tribes that were there, they didn't want anything to do with the outsiders coming through

[00:57:59] their land. Even Alexander, after a couple of skirmishes with the locals said, you know what is not worth it.

[00:58:06] We're going to go through and we're going to go after India. We're not even going to try here.

[00:58:10] We're going to go straight through. It's too difficult.

[00:58:14] And there was this idea that maybe

[00:58:18] there was so much there, it just permeates.

[00:58:22] Now, again, there's places in Afghanistan where you just

[00:58:26] permanently smell the blood.

[00:58:28] There was a place we stayed a couple of nights

[00:58:33] where, from what one of the interpreters and

[00:58:36] one of the older guys had told me, a bunch of Russians during the

[00:58:40] Russo-Afghan War in the, I think the 60s or 70s,

[00:58:45] they were obliterated up here.

[00:58:48] They were burnt out of troop carriers and tanks and just wreckage,

[00:58:54] just absolutely mangled and destroyed not too far from there.

[00:58:59] And it was just eerie.

[00:59:02] Middle of the desert during the day.

[00:59:06] And it was cold.

[00:59:09] Sickening cold.

[00:59:10] You just smell blood.

[00:59:11] And I never had been in a place in that desert,

[00:59:17] in the mountainous areas at least,

[00:59:19] where there was no wind.

[00:59:21] Usually you're gumming up and down these mountains.

[00:59:23] You've got a breeze that kind of twists around.

[00:59:26] But you get into this one area and it's just weird.

[00:59:30] So weird.

[00:59:32] And it just kind of creeps you out, you know.

[00:59:36] But it's, again, Afghanistan is one of those places that

[00:59:39] it leaves a mark on you more than you think.

[00:59:43] Because with all the horrible stuff that was there,

[00:59:47] one of the most, and I'm very grateful that this is one of the

[00:59:52] most profound memories I have of the place,

[00:59:56] we were on a patrol.

[00:59:58] That was supposed to be three days.

[01:00:01] Wound up being nine.

[01:00:04] And I remember one morning I was real pissed off.

[01:00:07] Woke up very early before it was even daylight.

[01:00:10] And I was just sitting there staring off into the dark under my night vision.

[01:00:14] And I realized the sun was about to start coming up.

[01:00:16] So I peeled off my MVGs and just decided, you know,

[01:00:20] I'm going to watch the sun sunrise.

[01:00:22] And I watched the sun come up.

[01:00:25] And the explosion of color coming up over those mountains,

[01:00:30] it was like every single color in creation had been put into that mountain.

[01:00:37] Just rolling almost like rivers of fire were pouring off of the horizon.

[01:00:46] Red, gold, amber, green, just rivulets of shining emerald and teal,

[01:00:57] dotting pockets of fire.

[01:01:00] Wow.

[01:01:02] And it moved almost like rivers of serpents

[01:01:08] flowing down into the mountains and the valleys.

[01:01:12] And when it hit the valleys, it would catch the foliage and light it up from underneath like torches.

[01:01:19] The level of peace I felt in that moment, I've never felt since.

[01:01:25] I wanted to just, I, at that moment, that was one of the first times I ever made a wish.

[01:01:31] And it came true.

[01:01:32] And I just said, I wish I could keep this moment forever.

[01:01:37] And for 12 years, I have had that memory.

[01:01:41] It's the most vivid memory I have ever had.

[01:01:45] And I'm so grateful that that is one of the most vivid memories in my life.

[01:01:51] Wow.

[01:01:52] And this was the sun rising.

[01:01:55] A sunrise.

[01:01:56] A sunrise.

[01:01:56] Like you've never seen it in your life.

[01:01:59] I never will.

[01:02:00] Is just.

[01:02:02] Wow.

[01:02:02] Do you think it was a combination of all that you've already experienced,

[01:02:07] everything, the darkness, the pain, the chaos and everything.

[01:02:12] And then at that one moment, that one moment when you were just zoned in or honed in onto something,

[01:02:19] it just, it illuminated it that much more and you were able to see it in its purest form.

[01:02:26] Oh yeah.

[01:02:26] I needed something.

[01:02:29] It was, it was definitely, it would call it God, call it the universe, call it divinity, call it what you will.

[01:02:39] And it answered.

[01:02:41] It said, yeah, you need this.

[01:02:45] Damn.

[01:02:46] I'm, I'm eternally grateful.

[01:02:49] You know, I have, I have my beliefs.

[01:02:52] And I'm very thankful.

[01:02:54] And I say thanks in my own way.

[01:02:56] And, you know, anyone has their own beliefs.

[01:02:59] You, you, you hold true to what your own beliefs are and the answer.

[01:03:02] So it is definitely there.

[01:03:05] But when it comes to, it comes to beliefs.

[01:03:07] When I talked to my interpreter, who, who, of course he was Muslim.

[01:03:10] He said, well, you're only slightly wrong in who you're thinking, but that's okay.

[01:03:16] At least you're not him over there.

[01:03:20] I went, okay, that's fine.

[01:03:21] But me, the three of us that were very close together sounded like a bad joke.

[01:03:26] Anytime I told stories about the three of us, it was like a Catholic, a Muslim, and a Jew sitting on the side of a mountain.

[01:03:32] So this is, this is going to end well, but no, true story.

[01:03:36] It was amazing.

[01:03:38] That was a beautiful, I mean, just, just the way you explained it, it sounds like you were looking, like you're looking at it still in your mind's eye right now.

[01:03:47] It's so, but like you said, it's so vivid.

[01:03:49] Oh yeah, I'm staring at my monitor and it's almost like I can paint it with my eyes right there on the monitor.

[01:03:55] It was, you know, sometimes they say when these, when these, like, let's just say, for instance, if you want to call it God, if you want to call it a divine being, if you want to call it the great mother earth or whatever it is.

[01:04:07] But sometimes when these, these things happen that really, they grab your conscience, they really get your attention and wake you up on the inside all the way from the deep, deep down in the deep downs that it, it doesn't, it doesn't happen too late.

[01:04:25] It doesn't happen too early, but it's always right when you need it the most.

[01:04:29] Oh, definitely.

[01:04:59] The painter's brush, if you will, to help me with language and how language can help to describe a scene or a setting.

[01:05:08] So really just kind of push things forward for myself as a writer.

[01:05:13] Yeah.

[01:05:13] And like I said, the journey and the experiences that I'm having now all started way on back then.

[01:05:23] All these experiences back from 2012 and onwards definitely moved me forward to where I was going to be and becoming a writer and everything else.

[01:05:34] Because there are stories that were trapped inside my head for a very long time.

[01:05:39] And then at first I would just turn them into tabletop role playing game scenarios and have those adventures with friends.

[01:05:48] And then my friends who were playing the game as I was running the game kept just saying, you should write a story.

[01:05:55] You should write a story.

[01:05:56] You should write a book.

[01:05:56] And finally, you know, I got out of the army in 2023.

[01:06:02] Were you journaling at all during your deployments?

[01:06:05] No.

[01:06:07] No, I wasn't.

[01:06:08] Okay.

[01:06:09] These were all just, I would lay in my bunk or I would just sit and daydream and I would come up with these stories just in my head as entertainment.

[01:06:22] I've always been a fan of the greats like C.S. Lewis, a little bit of the C.S. Lewis.

[01:06:31] Not so much in the style, but in the world building.

[01:06:33] J.R. Tolkien, though, is a huge influence in my life, especially now.

[01:06:40] After reading The Silmarillion and after reading a lot of his letters, it really kind of struck home, I think, now that I've read the letters.

[01:06:51] And some of the contemporary works about him and his time in World War I, it's kind of driven home why his works have kind of influenced me a little bit more now.

[01:07:06] And for me personally, I will always try to avoid writing in his way and his style out of respect for J.R. Tolkien.

[01:07:21] Simply because I do not want to emulate and copy the man.

[01:07:24] However, I do want to carry the tradition of having characters and a world which may feel real for the characters that are within and a world that people would want to visit.

[01:07:41] So that is about as close as I would ever want to become to Tolkien.

[01:07:47] And the other reason that Tolkien was a huge influence on me is, like I mentioned in the letters, when he comes back from World War I, if you read his letters, he very clearly is having very, very, very dark days.

[01:08:06] I honestly think he was on the edge.

[01:08:12] And he may very well have been saved by writing, just from the tone.

[01:08:23] And what convinces me a little bit more is when you read The Hobbit in the part where I don't know how familiar you're with The Hobbit, if you've seen the movies or the book.

[01:08:35] No, my wife loves it. I can't say that I'm too familiar with it, but I know she was really on a good binge and she enjoyed it.

[01:08:43] So if I use, say, the movie, probably more familiar with the movies then, because they got very popular.

[01:08:49] So the scene in the movie where Bilbo has Thorin, the dwarf leader.

[01:08:55] He's dying after fighting with the Pale Orc.

[01:09:00] And Thorin dies with Bilbo.

[01:09:05] With that entire scene, up until that point, Thorin has been extremely dismissive.

[01:09:10] Doesn't want to really acknowledge Bilbo.

[01:09:12] Doesn't really care about his name.

[01:09:14] Looks at him as more of a hindrance.

[01:09:16] Wasn't really thrilled that he had joined in the first place.

[01:09:19] Looks at him more of like a necessary evil.

[01:09:23] That tone, to me, is very reminiscent of World War I company officers who have lost so many men in the trenches that when they get yet another new recruit, they don't care.

[01:09:37] They're done caring.

[01:09:39] It's the same tone.

[01:09:41] So when he dies in Bilbo's arms, and Bilbo and Thorin are able to have that kind of moment where they settle things amicably, Bilbo can't cry and grieve like he wants to because something else is going on.

[01:10:02] There's still a job to do.

[01:10:03] So he stands up, turns, looks at Gandalf and says, I'm glad we were able to part on good terms, and then leaves.

[01:10:13] He is now desensitized the same way that Thorin is.

[01:10:19] Bilbo, or I would say Tolkien, has PTSD.

[01:10:23] Bilbo has PTSD, straight up, right there.

[01:10:26] He's numb.

[01:10:27] Or they would say back then in World War I, shell shock.

[01:10:30] Shell shock, right.

[01:10:31] So then Bilbo just is, you know, he's writing his books, he's doing his thing for all those years up until the Lord of the Rings starts up.

[01:10:40] And he goes on his next little adventure to live with the elves.

[01:10:46] He's still this happy-go-lucky, retired-esque hobbit when Frodo comes up and Bilbo winds up giving him the sword and the mithril shirt.

[01:11:00] He hasn't really changed his mannerisms.

[01:11:02] But this entire time, he's got PTSD.

[01:11:05] He's got depression.

[01:11:06] He's just hiding it.

[01:11:08] What has started his downfall is back when Gandalf tells him, well, you got to give that ring up.

[01:11:14] Well, that ring is the one thing that made him useful to Thorin.

[01:11:18] That ring is the one thing that connected him with his friends.

[01:11:22] But he gives it up.

[01:11:23] He's like, okay, you know what?

[01:11:25] This is the start of my healing journey.

[01:11:27] I'm going to go take care of myself.

[01:11:29] He's not going to go live with the elves.

[01:11:31] He's going to therapy.

[01:11:34] That's what it is.

[01:11:36] That's what Bilbo's doing during Lord of the Rings.

[01:11:38] He's going to therapy.

[01:11:40] He knows he has a problem at this point.

[01:11:42] And the first step is to get rid of something, addiction, and give the addiction up.

[01:11:50] Something that not only was powerful, something that was connecting him to painful memories.

[01:11:55] So he gives up the ring.

[01:11:57] Well, now he's reintroduced to Frodo.

[01:12:01] Frodo comes up.

[01:12:03] Bilbo's excited.

[01:12:04] He goes, oh, well, I know you're going on this adventure with the dwarves.

[01:12:07] And he starts having the memories.

[01:12:10] He's remembering Thorin.

[01:12:11] He's remembering the other dwarves.

[01:12:13] He's remembering the battles.

[01:12:14] He goes, oh, great.

[01:12:16] Well, you're going to need Mithril Shark.

[01:12:18] And he holds up this shirt, the same shirt that his friend Thorin gave him.

[01:12:24] Says, well, it protected me.

[01:12:26] It's going to protect you.

[01:12:27] I don't want you to die like my friends did.

[01:12:29] Okay, there you go.

[01:12:30] Then he grabs Sting, the sword.

[01:12:34] Thorin gave him that sword.

[01:12:37] Thorin made sure that he knew how to use that sword.

[01:12:40] Thorin also kind of mocked him about the sword in The Hobbit.

[01:12:45] Well, he gives Frodo that sword.

[01:12:47] That's now two more things that connect him to all of his friends on his adventure.

[01:12:53] He's giving everything up.

[01:12:55] He's losing every connection he has to his friends.

[01:12:58] He's losing all of his memories.

[01:13:00] So when he asks, can I see that ring one last time?

[01:13:04] He's not asking, can I see the ring because I want to have that power?

[01:13:09] He's saying, I don't want to lose my friends.

[01:13:13] I want to see my friends again.

[01:13:16] That's what it is.

[01:13:17] He's lost everything.

[01:13:19] That's why Tolkien, to me, hits a little harder when I read him.

[01:13:28] Because he is talking not just about a ring of power or a little adventure.

[01:13:36] He's talking about beings, people that will give up everything and lose everything and still move forward.

[01:13:49] Wow.

[01:13:51] That's putting a whole other light on top of that story.

[01:13:59] The desensitizing.

[01:14:01] And I've heard this from people before in the war, in combat, and being out there day in, day out, and witnessing everything that's going on around you.

[01:14:13] Having to do things that in, I don't know if you want to call it normal conditions, but you wouldn't have to be doing that.

[01:14:20] Some people, they become completely desensitized to everything.

[01:14:27] And I'm not too sure how that looked for you and even afterwards, especially because you had two deployments.

[01:14:35] So now coming back in and into the real, not the real world, but outside of a combat zone and the feelings, the emotions, maybe the will to live or the inspiration to want to go about life outside of a uniform.

[01:14:54] Were you, for some time, just numb to it all?

[01:14:58] Definitely the first one.

[01:14:59] The first one, it wasn't really registering how brutal some of the things could be.

[01:15:08] How on the knife's edge, just a random person's death could be.

[01:15:15] How quickly that someone else's world could just shatter on getting the green light or a thumbs up.

[01:15:24] To us, it was really just another day, another job.

[01:15:30] Yeah.

[01:15:31] And a big part of why we got driven into that corner was we're getting rocketed on our base four to five times a day, every single day for months.

[01:15:43] So anytime we got let outside the wire, it felt like being that pit bull that finally got let off the chain.

[01:15:50] Because the other big frustrating factor during my first deployment was the brigade that I was a member of, it felt like to us that we were being held back a lot.

[01:16:07] But there was an overall tone at the higher command levels of not wanting to pursue the fight too aggressively.

[01:16:17] Or the, I should say, the brigade command was being told not to pursue the fight too aggressively because of optics.

[01:16:26] And this was not a military decision.

[01:16:29] This was a political decision.

[01:16:32] And this was met with very less than political responses from those of us that were on the ground.

[01:16:41] The overwhelming verbal response was, fine, you come here and do it then, congressman, senator, whatever.

[01:16:51] And since then, and my opinion still holds to this day, is if you want to conduct a war, then you conduct a war.

[01:17:02] If you want to have a military occupation, you conduct a military operation.

[01:17:07] If you want to play politics, you have no need for us.

[01:17:13] We're not a political tool.

[01:17:15] We're a military force.

[01:17:17] And what wound up happening is, for about six or seven months, they let American men and women in uniforms sit in buckets and get shot at while American politicians beat their chest on TV and the radio talking about how brave they were for standing on the floor of the Senate and the House.

[01:17:42] And voting on new referendums and voting on the House and voting on new referendums and bills that would change the way we fought the war.

[01:17:50] Or, even better, talk about how cowardly the American military leadership was for not conducting the war in a way they deemed responsible.

[01:18:03] And then not recommend how to conduct that war.

[01:18:10] So, we were getting all this news, of course, the entire way.

[01:18:13] Then they cut our funding and stopped paying us for about two months.

[01:18:16] So, that was another great period of that deployment.

[01:18:21] You're out there deployed?

[01:18:23] Mm-hmm.

[01:18:24] In a combat zone and you didn't get paid for two months?

[01:18:29] Yep.

[01:18:31] Wow.

[01:18:33] So, I mean, best part during that two months, the Taliban stopped shooting at us.

[01:18:40] It was almost like they had to have known.

[01:18:43] Knowing what I know now, they had to have known.

[01:18:47] It is disgusting.

[01:18:50] Really.

[01:18:51] Wow.

[01:18:53] Because fast forward to it, and it gets better.

[01:18:57] It gets so much better.

[01:18:59] So, fast forward to the next deployment for the withdrawal.

[01:19:04] When we started getting the refugees in, and at this point, I'm with a medical unit.

[01:19:08] We're getting people, we're trying to just take care of injuries, inoculations, blood infusions.

[01:19:16] Anything we needed to do before we get them on planes and evacuate them.

[01:19:20] The worst part about this entire thing was kids.

[01:19:24] Kids that absolutely knew what had happened.

[01:19:30] You know, so, I mean, I wish, I wish that these kids would just scream and cry.

[01:19:36] They wouldn't.

[01:19:38] The worst one that sticks with me is a four-year-old girl that was leaning up against a tent,

[01:19:43] and the look of just dead look in her eyes, and all I could think was, please scream, yell at me.

[01:19:50] Just blame me.

[01:19:52] I don't care.

[01:19:53] Just show me an emotion.

[01:19:55] And...

[01:19:56] Nothing.

[01:19:57] Nothing.

[01:19:58] Wow.

[01:20:01] And that haunted me.

[01:20:04] Still haunts me.

[01:20:05] Now, and the majority of the children you were seeing at that time, they had no emotion?

[01:20:12] Uh-uh.

[01:20:12] It was very muted.

[01:20:13] If they had any emotion, it was muted.

[01:20:16] It was very downtrodden, very confused as to...

[01:20:21] And it was confused in the way of, I thought the Americans were here to help us.

[01:20:24] Why do we have to leave Afghanistan?

[01:20:26] Why didn't they win?

[01:20:27] Why are the Taliban here?

[01:20:29] Why is the...

[01:20:30] Oh, we're the better one.

[01:20:33] Why is the American government helping the Taliban?

[01:20:37] Do you know how many times I had to, through an interpreter or through broken Pashtun and broken Farsi,

[01:20:44] explain to Afghans that the American government is not, to my knowledge, an ally of the Taliban?

[01:20:55] And they did not believe me.

[01:20:57] The Taliban was going around screaming,

[01:21:01] glory to the Taliban and our American ally government.

[01:21:07] When you have the Taliban declaring the American government their great ally and not the white devil,

[01:21:17] keep in mind, the American military was their enemy, according to them.

[01:21:24] The American government was their friend.

[01:21:27] Makes sense to me, though.

[01:21:30] Because to us, when we were over there dealing with that crap,

[01:21:35] having the Taliban and the American government face off against the American military made a lot of sense.

[01:21:41] So there was, on the American military side of things, especially after Abbey Gate,

[01:21:49] the tone of uniformed persons in between uniformed persons and the military and the federal government

[01:21:57] took a very sharp turn.

[01:22:00] Especially after what the federal government's reaction was.

[01:22:04] I'm disgusted to this day about what happened.

[01:22:07] More so because the Taliban told the federal government that the airfield was too dirty.

[01:22:19] So, the American ambassador and the liaisons came down to our staging area and ordered us,

[01:22:27] quote,

[01:22:28] quote,

[01:22:30] you need to put some people together and organize teams to clean the airfield

[01:22:36] so that the Taliban can come in and stage on the airfield

[01:22:41] because it is too dirty for them.

[01:22:44] So you need to pick up all the trash,

[01:22:46] move all the burned out vehicles,

[01:22:49] get rid of all the torn down tents,

[01:22:53] any of the broken equipment needs to be put over by a refuse side.

[01:22:58] And you need to make sure all the buildings are habitable

[01:23:01] and that there's no garbage

[01:23:05] and that the bathrooms are clean

[01:23:07] before the Taliban come occupy the airfield.

[01:23:11] So we had to clean an airfield

[01:23:14] for people that

[01:23:16] we had been fighting since 2000

[01:23:20] because

[01:23:21] they were not happy with its conditions.

[01:23:24] Oh, and they stood

[01:23:25] on the other side of the fence

[01:23:27] laughing at us

[01:23:28] and mocking us.

[01:23:33] Wow.

[01:23:34] And then, I don't know if you've seen that also,

[01:23:36] but then would you see at some times

[01:23:38] or some points,

[01:23:39] would you see the

[01:23:40] news cameras come in

[01:23:42] or would they, you know,

[01:23:43] have any of this on footage?

[01:23:44] Oh, they had a field day.

[01:23:46] They had a fucking field day.

[01:23:48] So that's what I,

[01:23:49] to me, it sounds like,

[01:23:50] I mean, correct me if I'm wrong,

[01:23:51] just from the outside looking in,

[01:23:53] like as if all this was just a show piece put together

[01:23:57] so then it could be presented in a certain way

[01:24:00] to the American public

[01:24:02] and to whoever,

[01:24:03] the rest of the world

[01:24:05] as to what is going on

[01:24:07] and what they would like them to see.

[01:24:08] You know how many Americans work for Al Jazeera apparently?

[01:24:12] I'm sure it's a big number.

[01:24:16] A lot.

[01:24:17] That's a lot.

[01:24:18] At first I thought it was CNN.

[01:24:20] I thought it was CNN

[01:24:21] until they walked up and I saw the badge.

[01:24:22] That doesn't surprise me.

[01:24:24] But I know I saw the same footage from Al Jazeera

[01:24:26] on MSNBC and CNN.

[01:24:29] At the expense of lies.

[01:24:33] So almost all this,

[01:24:34] like all these things that happen compounding

[01:24:38] and I'm not alone in this.

[01:24:40] All this stuff just...

[01:24:41] And you're in the front line

[01:24:42] and you're seeing this.

[01:24:44] You've already been through,

[01:24:45] this is your second deployment, correct?

[01:24:47] This was the second one.

[01:24:48] This was the end.

[01:24:49] Because I almost had,

[01:24:51] this was almost my third deployment

[01:24:53] because the one that was supposed to be my second

[01:24:55] was supposed to go to Iraq when I was in Alaska.

[01:24:58] But I was medically reclassed

[01:25:00] out of the infantry back then.

[01:25:01] That was in 2015 or 16.

[01:25:04] And that one,

[01:25:05] so that one threw me off the edge

[01:25:07] because back then I got reclassed into medical.

[01:25:09] So by the time,

[01:25:10] fast forward into

[01:25:12] withdrawal from Afghanistan and Abbey Gate,

[01:25:14] by that point,

[01:25:15] I'm already in a medical unit.

[01:25:17] But there's guys

[01:25:18] that are in this cleaning detail

[01:25:20] that have been combat arms

[01:25:22] and have six,

[01:25:24] seven,

[01:25:25] nine combat deployments

[01:25:27] in Afghanistan and Iraq

[01:25:29] that are now having to walk around

[01:25:30] with gloves

[01:25:32] picking up garbage

[01:25:35] in front of the Taliban.

[01:25:36] Wow.

[01:25:37] And this is to clear the airspace.

[01:25:40] On the count of the Pentagon

[01:25:43] or whoever the powers that be,

[01:25:45] you know,

[01:25:46] behind the scenes,

[01:25:47] nice suits

[01:25:47] and shiny shoes

[01:25:50] and plain politician

[01:25:51] or politicster.

[01:25:53] Oh,

[01:25:54] but the military brass,

[01:25:55] they're not,

[01:25:56] they're not exempt from responsibility

[01:25:57] on that call either

[01:25:59] because those generals and hire,

[01:26:02] they had full authority

[01:26:04] to say,

[01:26:05] kick rocks,

[01:26:06] no.

[01:26:07] But,

[01:26:08] exactly.

[01:26:09] you,

[01:26:10] and you've seen this

[01:26:10] from the time

[01:26:12] they get to a certain rank

[01:26:13] in the officer corps,

[01:26:15] they're,

[01:26:15] especially nowadays,

[01:26:16] you are no longer

[01:26:18] a military officer,

[01:26:18] you are a politician

[01:26:20] of uniform.

[01:26:22] There are

[01:26:22] a very select few

[01:26:24] that I have personally seen

[01:26:26] that are true blue officers

[01:26:28] that have full command

[01:26:29] and authority

[01:26:30] and respect of their men.

[01:26:32] We are no longer

[01:26:33] in the age

[01:26:34] of Patton

[01:26:36] and

[01:26:37] Montgomery.

[01:26:39] Those,

[01:26:40] those days are dead.

[01:26:41] We're no longer

[01:26:42] in the age

[01:26:43] of Mattis.

[01:26:45] When he was in uniform,

[01:26:46] I should say,

[01:26:48] those days are dead.

[01:26:50] It's safe to say

[01:26:51] then the,

[01:26:51] the morale

[01:26:52] of everybody around you

[01:26:53] was about

[01:26:54] on that same frequency.

[01:26:56] You guys were seeing

[01:26:58] toast of,

[01:26:59] what's going on here?

[01:27:00] Toast.

[01:27:01] It was going down,

[01:27:02] it was already going down

[01:27:03] by the time

[01:27:05] the federal government's

[01:27:07] response after Abbey Gate

[01:27:08] had been

[01:27:09] nothing.

[01:27:11] We were

[01:27:12] baying for blood.

[01:27:13] We were caught.

[01:27:14] So,

[01:27:15] when that happened,

[01:27:17] there,

[01:27:18] oh gosh,

[01:27:19] I can't even say it

[01:27:19] that way.

[01:27:20] There were

[01:27:21] multiple

[01:27:22] combat

[01:27:24] units,

[01:27:26] specialized combat

[01:27:27] units

[01:27:28] within

[01:27:30] an hour,

[01:27:32] within an hour

[01:27:34] striking distance

[01:27:36] of

[01:27:36] Abbey Gate

[01:27:38] and the airport.

[01:27:39] There were

[01:27:40] assets

[01:27:40] within minutes

[01:27:42] of

[01:27:44] that area.

[01:27:46] you can literally

[01:27:47] pick up a radio

[01:27:47] or the phone

[01:27:48] and say go.

[01:27:49] And the war's

[01:27:50] back on.

[01:27:52] And we,

[01:27:53] and they were there.

[01:27:54] They were all there.

[01:27:55] If not all,

[01:27:56] a good chunk

[01:27:58] of the people

[01:27:59] we needed to kill

[01:28:00] were right there.

[01:28:02] And instead,

[01:28:04] Joe Biden

[01:28:06] decided to

[01:28:07] lean back

[01:28:08] and take it.

[01:28:12] And then,

[01:28:14] he and his

[01:28:15] administration

[01:28:16] decided to

[01:28:17] spit in the

[01:28:18] faces of

[01:28:18] 13 families

[01:28:19] plus others

[01:28:21] and

[01:28:22] now

[01:28:24] the person

[01:28:25] who should

[01:28:26] have been

[01:28:27] helping him

[01:28:27] along in his

[01:28:28] administration

[01:28:29] and

[01:28:30] should have

[01:28:31] also been

[01:28:31] involved

[01:28:32] with

[01:28:33] assisting

[01:28:33] in the

[01:28:34] administration's

[01:28:35] duties

[01:28:35] yet

[01:28:36] seemingly

[01:28:38] had been

[01:28:38] disappearing,

[01:28:39] had the call

[01:28:40] to go on

[01:28:40] TV

[01:28:41] twice

[01:28:42] now and

[01:28:43] say

[01:28:43] not a single

[01:28:44] military service

[01:28:45] member has

[01:28:46] died under

[01:28:46] the

[01:28:47] current

[01:28:48] administration.

[01:28:49] It fucking

[01:28:50] skews me.

[01:28:52] It's crazy

[01:28:53] how they

[01:28:53] can say

[01:28:55] that.

[01:28:55] Just a lot

[01:28:56] of things

[01:28:57] in general

[01:28:58] say it's

[01:28:59] like the

[01:28:59] exact opposite

[01:29:00] of what they're

[01:29:01] saying is

[01:29:01] what's really

[01:29:02] going on.

[01:29:03] Oh,

[01:29:04] and it's

[01:29:04] both sides.

[01:29:05] Yeah.

[01:29:06] It's both

[01:29:06] sides because

[01:29:07] what I've told

[01:29:07] people now,

[01:29:08] oh,

[01:29:08] well,

[01:29:08] then you're

[01:29:09] a hardcore

[01:29:09] Republican.

[01:29:10] No,

[01:29:10] I'm not.

[01:29:11] I am not

[01:29:12] because here's

[01:29:13] the difference

[01:29:13] in between

[01:29:14] Democrats and

[01:29:14] Republicans when

[01:29:15] it comes to

[01:29:16] politics.

[01:29:17] You take that

[01:29:17] letter D,

[01:29:19] put a little

[01:29:19] penis hanging off

[01:29:20] the end of it

[01:29:21] and give it a

[01:29:21] leg.

[01:29:22] That's it.

[01:29:24] Yeah.

[01:29:25] That's really

[01:29:25] odd.

[01:29:26] It's the same

[01:29:26] damn thing.

[01:29:27] You can hide

[01:29:28] an independent

[01:29:29] in both of

[01:29:30] them.

[01:29:31] That's it.

[01:29:32] There is no

[01:29:32] difference in

[01:29:33] between those

[01:29:33] three.

[01:29:33] As soon as

[01:29:34] you grab,

[01:29:35] I don't care

[01:29:35] what color tie

[01:29:36] you're wearing.

[01:29:37] I don't care

[01:29:37] what color suit

[01:29:38] you're wearing.

[01:29:39] I don't care

[01:29:40] what party

[01:29:40] affiliation you

[01:29:41] claim to be.

[01:29:42] There's only

[01:29:42] two parties.

[01:29:44] There is the

[01:29:45] government and

[01:29:45] there's the

[01:29:46] people.

[01:29:46] That's where

[01:29:47] it's come to.

[01:29:48] And it

[01:29:48] freaking sucks.

[01:29:49] The rest is

[01:29:50] theatric.

[01:29:51] There's two

[01:29:52] wings and

[01:29:52] the same

[01:29:53] bird.

[01:29:54] Yeah.

[01:29:55] Oh, God.

[01:29:56] And it's a

[01:29:57] we should have

[01:29:58] we should have

[01:29:58] taken the

[01:29:59] turkey as

[01:30:00] our national

[01:30:00] bird like

[01:30:01] Franklin wanted

[01:30:02] to because then

[01:30:02] at least it

[01:30:03] would make sense.

[01:30:03] It's fat.

[01:30:04] My Lord.

[01:30:06] Sorry.

[01:30:06] I hate politics.

[01:30:08] I'll get off

[01:30:08] of that.

[01:30:09] I hate it.

[01:30:10] No, you're

[01:30:11] you know, this

[01:30:12] is this is

[01:30:13] something that

[01:30:13] that you have a

[01:30:14] strong conviction

[01:30:15] about.

[01:30:16] Yeah.

[01:30:16] Like I said

[01:30:17] from the very

[01:30:17] very beginning

[01:30:18] this is about

[01:30:19] your story,

[01:30:21] your journey,

[01:30:22] a lot of

[01:30:22] your thoughts

[01:30:23] and things

[01:30:24] that you've

[01:30:25] been through.

[01:30:26] And I mean

[01:30:27] we don't even

[01:30:28] have enough time

[01:30:29] on one podcast

[01:30:30] to go through

[01:30:31] all of the

[01:30:32] all of the

[01:30:32] gosh no.

[01:30:33] Yeah.

[01:30:33] You've been

[01:30:34] through hell

[01:30:34] and back six

[01:30:35] seven different

[01:30:36] times.

[01:30:36] And like I

[01:30:37] told you from

[01:30:38] the beginning

[01:30:38] still kicking

[01:30:39] still moving

[01:30:40] but it was a

[01:30:41] process.

[01:30:41] I'm sure

[01:30:42] like in the

[01:30:43] beginning some

[01:30:44] of the

[01:30:45] the ways

[01:30:46] that you

[01:30:46] viewed maybe

[01:30:48] your PTSD

[01:30:49] well for

[01:30:49] when you

[01:30:50] said you

[01:30:50] didn't

[01:30:50] acknowledge

[01:30:51] acknowledge

[01:30:52] it but

[01:30:52] the writing

[01:30:54] and the

[01:30:55] therapeutic

[01:30:55] effect that

[01:30:57] writing can

[01:30:57] have.

[01:30:58] It seems

[01:30:58] to be

[01:30:59] to me

[01:30:59] you know

[01:31:00] I'm fairly

[01:31:01] the podcast

[01:31:02] it's not like

[01:31:03] I've been

[01:31:04] doing this

[01:31:04] for 15

[01:31:05] 20 years

[01:31:05] or so

[01:31:06] I've just

[01:31:06] now getting

[01:31:07] into the

[01:31:08] groove of it

[01:31:09] but a lot

[01:31:09] of people

[01:31:09] that I've

[01:31:10] spoken with

[01:31:11] that I've

[01:31:11] had their

[01:31:11] own

[01:31:13] issues

[01:31:13] their own

[01:31:15] stories

[01:31:16] and ways

[01:31:17] that life

[01:31:17] affected

[01:31:18] them

[01:31:18] they found

[01:31:19] writing to

[01:31:20] be very

[01:31:21] therapeutic

[01:31:21] and it

[01:31:22] is I mean

[01:31:22] even by

[01:31:24] psychiatrists

[01:31:25] psychotherapists

[01:31:26] they've already

[01:31:27] acknowledged that

[01:31:27] writing can

[01:31:29] have a

[01:31:29] therapeutic

[01:31:30] effect

[01:31:30] and for

[01:31:31] you

[01:31:31] it seems

[01:31:32] like that

[01:31:33] was a

[01:31:34] real big

[01:31:35] ingredient

[01:31:36] to you

[01:31:37] working out

[01:31:39] a lot of

[01:31:40] the things

[01:31:40] that you

[01:31:40] were dealing

[01:31:41] with

[01:31:41] internally

[01:31:42] psychologically

[01:31:43] emotionally

[01:31:44] spiritually

[01:31:45] all those

[01:31:46] realms

[01:31:48] and ingredients

[01:31:49] that make

[01:31:49] us human

[01:31:50] so for

[01:31:51] you

[01:31:51] like say

[01:31:52] I was

[01:31:52] when I

[01:31:53] asked you

[01:31:53] about the

[01:31:54] desensitizing

[01:31:55] and once

[01:31:57] you come

[01:31:57] back from

[01:31:58] your deployments

[01:32:00] and just

[01:32:00] trying to

[01:32:02] go about

[01:32:02] a regular

[01:32:04] Joe life

[01:32:05] when you

[01:32:06] started to

[01:32:07] write

[01:32:08] did that

[01:32:08] in any

[01:32:09] way

[01:32:09] was that

[01:32:10] a painful

[01:32:11] process

[01:32:12] in the

[01:32:12] beginning

[01:32:13] because

[01:32:13] you're

[01:32:13] having

[01:32:14] to

[01:32:16] relive

[01:32:16] and

[01:32:17] recapture

[01:32:18] a lot

[01:32:18] of

[01:32:19] very

[01:32:19] sensitive

[01:32:20] memories

[01:32:21] with the

[01:32:22] first book

[01:32:23] version

[01:32:23] that I

[01:32:24] was going

[01:32:25] to write

[01:32:25] it really

[01:32:26] was

[01:32:26] that one

[01:32:27] I

[01:32:29] probably

[01:32:29] am not

[01:32:30] gonna have

[01:32:31] I'm probably

[01:32:31] not gonna

[01:32:32] do because

[01:32:34] it just

[01:32:35] didn't

[01:32:35] it didn't

[01:32:36] feel right

[01:32:36] for one

[01:32:37] and two

[01:32:38] it really

[01:32:40] was

[01:32:40] driving

[01:32:41] the story

[01:32:42] into a

[01:32:43] way that

[01:32:44] it felt

[01:32:45] wrong

[01:32:45] originally

[01:32:46] I was

[01:32:47] writing

[01:32:48] a

[01:32:49] manuscript

[01:32:50] that was

[01:32:51] going to

[01:32:51] follow

[01:32:51] a

[01:32:53] one

[01:32:54] individual

[01:32:54] who

[01:32:55] comes back

[01:32:56] from the

[01:32:56] Middle East

[01:32:57] who

[01:32:58] is

[01:32:59] convinced

[01:33:00] that

[01:33:01] he

[01:33:02] has

[01:33:03] complex

[01:33:05] PTSD

[01:33:06] and is

[01:33:07] dealing

[01:33:08] with

[01:33:08] these

[01:33:08] traumas

[01:33:08] and he's

[01:33:09] having

[01:33:09] hallucinations

[01:33:10] of a

[01:33:11] little

[01:33:12] girl

[01:33:12] that

[01:33:13] his

[01:33:14] platoon

[01:33:14] murdered

[01:33:15] and he

[01:33:17] says

[01:33:17] murdered

[01:33:18] what

[01:33:18] the

[01:33:19] scenario

[01:33:19] actually

[01:33:20] is

[01:33:20] or was

[01:33:22] was a

[01:33:23] small

[01:33:23] girl

[01:33:25] was

[01:33:26] frightened

[01:33:26] ran

[01:33:27] out of

[01:33:27] a house

[01:33:28] to

[01:33:28] her

[01:33:29] neighbor's

[01:33:29] house

[01:33:30] got caught

[01:33:31] in the

[01:33:31] gunfire

[01:33:32] and

[01:33:32] one

[01:33:33] of the

[01:33:34] three

[01:33:34] soldiers

[01:33:35] who

[01:33:35] was

[01:33:36] exchanging

[01:33:36] gunfire

[01:33:37] with

[01:33:37] several

[01:33:38] government

[01:33:39] near

[01:33:40] this

[01:33:40] village

[01:33:41] one

[01:33:42] of

[01:33:42] the

[01:33:42] three

[01:33:43] shot

[01:33:44] her

[01:33:44] in the

[01:33:44] side

[01:33:44] of

[01:33:44] the

[01:33:44] head

[01:33:45] and

[01:33:45] killed

[01:33:45] her

[01:33:45] but

[01:33:46] of

[01:33:46] those

[01:33:46] three

[01:33:47] they

[01:33:47] don't

[01:33:47] know

[01:33:47] which

[01:33:48] one

[01:33:48] did

[01:33:48] it

[01:33:49] but

[01:33:49] each

[01:33:50] was

[01:33:50] convinced

[01:33:50] that

[01:33:51] they

[01:33:52] were

[01:33:52] the

[01:33:52] one

[01:33:52] who

[01:33:52] killed

[01:33:53] this

[01:33:53] little

[01:33:53] girl

[01:33:53] each

[01:34:05] had

[01:34:05] drunk

[01:34:05] drive

[01:34:05] an

[01:34:06] accident

[01:34:06] and

[01:34:06] crash

[01:34:07] into

[01:34:07] a

[01:34:08] tree

[01:34:08] and

[01:34:08] died

[01:34:08] the

[01:34:09] second

[01:34:09] one

[01:34:10] he

[01:34:12] he

[01:34:13] approached

[01:34:13] it

[01:34:13] more

[01:34:13] with

[01:34:14] an

[01:34:14] idea

[01:34:14] of

[01:34:16] preemptive

[01:34:17] strike

[01:34:18] really

[01:34:19] it was

[01:34:19] like

[01:34:19] well

[01:34:19] eventually

[01:34:20] they were

[01:34:20] going to be

[01:34:20] an enemy

[01:34:21] eventually

[01:34:21] whatever

[01:34:22] good riddance

[01:34:22] very heartless

[01:34:24] the third

[01:34:24] one

[01:34:25] haunted

[01:34:26] and

[01:34:27] he

[01:34:27] keeps

[01:34:28] having

[01:34:28] these

[01:34:28] visions

[01:34:28] of

[01:34:28] this

[01:34:28] little

[01:34:29] girl

[01:34:30] believes

[01:34:31] this

[01:34:31] little

[01:34:31] girl

[01:34:32] is

[01:34:33] an

[01:34:33] illusion

[01:34:34] just

[01:34:34] like

[01:34:35] his

[01:34:35] guilt

[01:34:36] following

[01:34:37] him

[01:34:37] around

[01:34:37] he

[01:34:38] eventually

[01:34:39] joined

[01:34:39] a

[01:34:40] law

[01:34:41] enforcement

[01:34:42] agency

[01:34:42] and

[01:34:44] the

[01:34:45] little

[01:34:45] girl

[01:34:45] he

[01:34:46] starts

[01:34:46] realizing

[01:34:47] this

[01:34:47] hallucination

[01:34:48] that he

[01:34:48] keeps

[01:34:49] secret

[01:34:51] points

[01:34:52] things

[01:34:52] out

[01:34:52] like

[01:34:53] the way

[01:34:54] blood

[01:34:54] spatter

[01:34:55] moves

[01:34:55] or

[01:34:55] shell

[01:34:56] casing

[01:34:56] someone

[01:34:56] missed

[01:34:57] small

[01:34:57] minute

[01:34:58] details

[01:34:58] that

[01:34:59] are

[01:35:00] not

[01:35:01] very

[01:35:04] intricate

[01:35:05] or

[01:35:05] very

[01:35:06] hidden

[01:35:07] just

[01:35:08] small

[01:35:08] things

[01:35:08] that

[01:35:09] any

[01:35:10] detective

[01:35:10] could

[01:35:11] notice

[01:35:11] with the

[01:35:11] proper

[01:35:11] amount

[01:35:12] of

[01:35:12] training

[01:35:13] but

[01:35:14] it

[01:35:15] was

[01:35:15] flowing

[01:35:16] in a

[01:35:16] way

[01:35:16] where

[01:35:17] he

[01:35:17] could

[01:35:18] convince

[01:35:18] himself

[01:35:18] that it

[01:35:19] was

[01:35:19] also

[01:35:19] his

[01:35:20] own

[01:35:20] mind

[01:35:20] process

[01:35:20] but

[01:35:21] it

[01:35:21] was

[01:35:21] just

[01:35:21] the

[01:35:21] illusion

[01:35:22] working

[01:35:23] along

[01:35:23] with

[01:35:23] his

[01:35:24] own

[01:35:24] thinking

[01:35:26] but

[01:35:26] the

[01:35:27] more

[01:35:27] I

[01:35:27] was

[01:35:27] moving

[01:35:27] along

[01:35:28] with

[01:35:28] it

[01:35:28] it

[01:35:29] just

[01:35:29] it

[01:35:30] wasn't

[01:35:30] feeling

[01:35:31] right

[01:35:31] it

[01:35:31] was

[01:35:31] bringing

[01:35:32] up

[01:35:32] a lot

[01:35:32] of

[01:35:33] memories

[01:35:34] that I

[01:35:34] would

[01:35:34] rather

[01:35:34] not

[01:35:35] have

[01:35:35] in my

[01:35:36] own

[01:35:37] mind

[01:35:37] at

[01:35:38] that

[01:35:38] time

[01:35:39] it

[01:35:40] was

[01:35:40] also

[01:35:40] dealing

[01:35:40] with

[01:35:41] the

[01:35:41] supernatural

[01:35:42] which

[01:35:45] considering

[01:35:45] just

[01:35:46] I don't

[01:35:46] deal

[01:35:46] well

[01:35:47] personally

[01:35:47] with

[01:35:48] what is

[01:35:49] called

[01:35:49] the

[01:35:49] spooky

[01:35:49] shit

[01:35:49] like

[01:35:50] as

[01:35:51] the

[01:35:51] guy

[01:35:51] on

[01:35:52] the

[01:35:52] internet

[01:35:52] the

[01:35:53] president

[01:35:53] of

[01:35:53] the

[01:35:53] Latinos

[01:35:54] against

[01:35:54] spooky

[01:35:54] shit

[01:35:54] likes

[01:35:54] to

[01:35:55] say

[01:35:55] I

[01:36:08] started

[01:36:08] having

[01:36:09] nightmares

[01:36:09] about

[01:36:09] ghosts

[01:36:10] I

[01:36:10] said

[01:36:10] nope

[01:36:11] done

[01:36:11] not

[01:36:12] writing

[01:36:12] it

[01:36:12] anymore

[01:36:14] and

[01:36:16] eventually

[01:36:16] started

[01:36:17] moving

[01:36:18] a

[01:36:19] similar

[01:36:19] concept

[01:36:20] where

[01:36:20] you

[01:36:20] have

[01:36:20] someone

[01:36:20] with

[01:36:21] it

[01:36:21] but

[01:36:21] instead

[01:36:21] of

[01:36:22] having

[01:36:22] the

[01:36:23] PTSD

[01:36:23] be

[01:36:23] front

[01:36:24] and

[01:36:24] center

[01:36:24] just

[01:36:25] kind

[01:36:25] of

[01:36:26] mute

[01:36:27] it

[01:36:27] down

[01:36:27] because

[01:36:27] that

[01:36:27] was

[01:36:27] the

[01:36:28] other

[01:36:28] thing

[01:36:28] I

[01:36:38] attitude

[01:36:39] of

[01:36:39] this

[01:36:39] character

[01:36:40] was

[01:36:40] so

[01:36:41] blatantly

[01:36:42] front

[01:36:42] line

[01:36:42] and

[01:36:42] center

[01:36:43] I

[01:36:43] hated

[01:36:43] the

[01:36:43] guy

[01:36:45] I

[01:36:45] found

[01:36:45] myself

[01:36:46] writing

[01:36:46] this

[01:36:46] character

[01:36:47] and

[01:36:47] thinking

[01:36:47] I'm

[01:36:47] going to

[01:36:48] have

[01:36:48] this

[01:36:48] guy

[01:36:48] put a

[01:36:48] gun

[01:36:49] to

[01:36:49] his

[01:36:49] head

[01:36:49] and

[01:36:49] shoot

[01:36:49] himself

[01:36:50] just

[01:36:50] so

[01:36:50] I

[01:36:50] can

[01:36:50] kill

[01:36:50] this

[01:36:51] character

[01:36:53] I

[01:36:53] hated

[01:36:54] this

[01:36:54] character

[01:36:54] so

[01:36:55] much

[01:36:56] I

[01:36:56] I

[01:36:57] reviled

[01:36:58] him

[01:36:58] I

[01:36:59] don't

[01:36:59] even

[01:36:59] remember

[01:36:59] this

[01:37:00] character's

[01:37:00] name

[01:37:00] I

[01:37:00] hated

[01:37:01] this

[01:37:01] character

[01:37:01] so

[01:37:01] much

[01:37:01] but

[01:37:02] with

[01:37:03] Hero

[01:37:04] of

[01:37:04] Aria

[01:37:05] I

[01:37:06] found

[01:37:06] myself

[01:37:07] laughing

[01:37:07] at

[01:37:08] these

[01:37:08] characters

[01:37:10] and

[01:37:10] that's

[01:37:10] how

[01:37:10] I

[01:37:11] felt

[01:37:11] I

[01:37:12] had

[01:37:12] actually

[01:37:12] kind

[01:37:13] of

[01:37:13] found

[01:37:13] a

[01:37:14] niche

[01:37:14] or

[01:37:14] found

[01:37:16] a

[01:37:16] world

[01:37:16] and

[01:37:17] some

[01:37:17] characters

[01:37:18] or I

[01:37:18] would say

[01:37:18] people

[01:37:19] that

[01:37:20] I

[01:37:21] liked

[01:37:21] so

[01:37:22] could

[01:37:23] I

[01:37:23] ask

[01:37:23] you

[01:37:23] what

[01:37:24] was

[01:37:24] it

[01:37:24] or

[01:37:24] maybe

[01:37:25] you

[01:37:25] did

[01:37:25] already

[01:37:25] you

[01:37:26] spoke

[01:37:26] about

[01:37:27] it

[01:37:27] when

[01:37:27] you

[01:37:27] were

[01:37:27] explaining

[01:37:28] him

[01:37:28] but

[01:37:28] what

[01:37:29] was

[01:37:29] it

[01:37:29] exactly

[01:37:29] like

[01:37:30] the

[01:37:30] main

[01:37:30] of

[01:37:31] it

[01:37:31] that

[01:37:32] you

[01:37:32] hated

[01:37:32] about

[01:37:32] that

[01:37:33] character

[01:37:33] he

[01:37:34] was

[01:37:34] far

[01:37:34] it

[01:37:35] was

[01:37:35] far

[01:37:35] too

[01:37:36] gloomy

[01:37:37] it

[01:37:38] was

[01:37:38] so

[01:37:38] depressing

[01:37:39] it

[01:37:39] was

[01:37:41] and

[01:37:42] really

[01:37:42] now that

[01:37:43] I'm

[01:37:43] really

[01:37:43] thinking

[01:37:43] about

[01:37:43] it

[01:37:43] honestly

[01:37:44] I

[01:37:44] think

[01:37:45] he

[01:37:45] reminded

[01:37:45] me

[01:37:46] too

[01:37:46] much

[01:37:46] of

[01:37:46] myself

[01:37:47] when

[01:37:47] I

[01:37:48] was

[01:38:01] what

[01:38:01] it

[01:38:01] was

[01:38:02] what

[01:38:03] the

[01:38:04] reason

[01:38:05] I

[01:38:05] asked

[01:38:05] that

[01:38:05] because

[01:38:06] sometimes

[01:38:06] when

[01:38:07] we

[01:38:08] have

[01:38:08] us

[01:38:08] they

[01:38:09] say

[01:38:10] it

[01:38:10] says

[01:38:10] sometimes

[01:38:11] projecting

[01:38:12] the

[01:38:12] shadow

[01:38:12] onto

[01:38:13] someone

[01:38:13] else

[01:38:14] and

[01:38:14] so

[01:38:14] like

[01:38:14] I

[01:38:14] know

[01:38:15] sometimes

[01:38:15] with

[01:38:15] me

[01:38:16] I

[01:38:16] catch

[01:38:16] myself

[01:38:17] doing

[01:38:17] that

[01:38:17] I

[01:38:17] try

[01:38:18] to

[01:38:18] be

[01:38:18] conscious

[01:38:18] about

[01:38:19] it

[01:38:19] and

[01:38:19] mindful

[01:38:20] when

[01:38:21] I'm

[01:38:21] reacting

[01:38:22] a

[01:38:22] certain

[01:38:22] way

[01:38:22] about

[01:38:23] something

[01:38:23] and

[01:38:24] like

[01:38:24] what

[01:38:25] is

[01:38:25] it

[01:38:25] about

[01:38:25] that

[01:38:26] that's

[01:38:26] causing

[01:38:27] me

[01:38:27] to

[01:38:27] stir

[01:38:27] up

[01:38:27] the

[01:38:28] way

[01:38:29] I

[01:38:32] deleted

[01:38:36] that

[01:38:37] file

[01:38:37] and

[01:38:37] I

[01:38:37] don't

[01:38:37] think

[01:38:38] I

[01:38:38] even

[01:38:38] printed

[01:38:38] it

[01:38:39] out

[01:38:39] anywhere

[01:38:39] it

[01:38:40] is

[01:38:40] gone

[01:38:41] to

[01:38:41] the

[01:38:41] nether

[01:38:42] of

[01:38:42] the

[01:38:43] cyberness

[01:38:44] of

[01:38:44] space

[01:38:44] it

[01:38:44] is

[01:38:45] toast

[01:38:45] oh

[01:38:46] wow

[01:38:46] okay

[01:38:46] you

[01:38:47] completely

[01:38:47] turned

[01:38:48] it

[01:38:48] to

[01:38:48] dust

[01:38:49] it

[01:38:50] is

[01:38:50] gone

[01:38:51] I

[01:38:51] will

[01:38:51] it

[01:38:52] yeah

[01:38:53] it

[01:38:53] is

[01:38:59] I

[01:39:00] definitely

[01:39:01] think

[01:39:01] that

[01:39:01] was

[01:39:02] it

[01:39:02] was

[01:39:02] so

[01:39:02] much

[01:39:03] like

[01:39:03] me

[01:39:03] whereas

[01:39:04] Bart

[01:39:05] honestly

[01:39:05] I

[01:39:05] think

[01:39:06] Bart

[01:39:06] as a

[01:39:07] character

[01:39:07] might

[01:39:08] be

[01:39:08] refined

[01:39:09] you

[01:39:09] no

[01:39:10] I

[01:39:11] don't

[01:39:11] think

[01:39:11] so

[01:39:12] Bart

[01:39:13] might

[01:39:13] be

[01:39:14] based

[01:39:14] on

[01:39:14] three

[01:39:15] people

[01:39:15] very

[01:39:16] loosely

[01:39:17] Bart

[01:39:17] might

[01:39:18] be

[01:39:18] based

[01:39:18] on

[01:39:18] three

[01:39:18] different

[01:39:19] people

[01:39:19] that

[01:39:28] let's

[01:39:29] just

[01:39:29] say

[01:39:29] you

[01:39:29] know

[01:39:29] this

[01:39:30] character

[01:39:30] that

[01:39:31] is

[01:39:31] now

[01:39:31] cyber

[01:39:32] dust

[01:39:32] this

[01:39:33] one

[01:39:33] that

[01:39:33] kind

[01:39:34] of

[01:39:34] reminded

[01:39:34] you

[01:39:35] of

[01:39:35] you

[01:39:36] in a

[01:39:36] way

[01:39:36] how

[01:39:36] you

[01:39:37] once

[01:39:37] were

[01:39:37] what

[01:39:38] was

[01:39:38] some

[01:39:38] steps

[01:39:39] or

[01:39:40] some

[01:39:40] moments

[01:39:40] where

[01:39:41] you

[01:39:41] were

[01:39:41] able

[01:39:41] to

[01:39:42] start

[01:39:43] to

[01:39:43] come

[01:39:45] out

[01:39:45] of

[01:39:45] that

[01:39:45] cloud

[01:39:46] or

[01:39:47] that

[01:39:47] dark

[01:39:47] pit

[01:39:48] of

[01:39:48] emptiness

[01:39:49] or despair

[01:39:50] and

[01:39:50] hopelessness

[01:39:51] my wife

[01:39:52] was a big

[01:39:52] part

[01:39:52] of that

[01:39:54] started

[01:39:55] having

[01:39:55] I actually

[01:39:56] started

[01:39:56] having a

[01:39:57] reason

[01:39:57] to stick

[01:39:58] around

[01:39:58] as it

[01:39:59] were

[01:40:00] which

[01:40:01] you know

[01:40:02] that's a

[01:40:03] far cry

[01:40:03] from

[01:40:03] 2012

[01:40:04] and onward

[01:40:05] support

[01:40:06] support

[01:40:08] is strong

[01:40:08] especially

[01:40:09] considering

[01:40:09] your

[01:40:09] background

[01:40:10] you said

[01:40:10] there was

[01:40:11] really

[01:40:11] no

[01:40:11] family

[01:40:12] that

[01:40:12] you

[01:40:12] found

[01:40:13] yourself

[01:40:14] rooted

[01:40:14] in

[01:40:15] no

[01:40:15] family

[01:40:15] tree

[01:40:16] but

[01:40:16] and

[01:40:17] our

[01:40:17] relationship

[01:40:18] is

[01:40:18] use

[01:40:19] the word

[01:40:19] goofy

[01:40:20] just

[01:40:21] goofy

[01:40:21] we're

[01:40:21] gremlins

[01:40:22] just

[01:40:23] absolute

[01:40:24] gremlins

[01:40:25] very much

[01:40:26] the

[01:40:27] like

[01:40:27] we'll

[01:40:28] run

[01:40:28] around

[01:40:28] and do

[01:40:28] like

[01:40:29] we see

[01:40:29] each

[01:40:30] other

[01:40:30] and go

[01:40:30] oh look

[01:40:31] it's my

[01:40:31] favorite

[01:40:31] human

[01:40:32] and make

[01:40:32] Zoidberg

[01:40:32] noises

[01:40:33] like

[01:40:35] that kind

[01:40:35] of

[01:40:35] that's

[01:40:36] the vibe

[01:40:37] type

[01:40:38] of thing

[01:40:39] you guys

[01:40:40] get

[01:40:40] just a lot

[01:40:40] of joy

[01:40:41] oh yeah

[01:40:42] we're very

[01:40:42] much like

[01:40:44] instead of

[01:40:44] hey honey

[01:40:45] would you

[01:40:45] like

[01:40:46] would you

[01:40:47] like

[01:40:57] of

[01:40:57] authority

[01:40:57] where you

[01:41:03] do you

[01:41:08] require

[01:41:12] sustenance

[01:41:12] and i

[01:41:13] will just

[01:41:13] i'll return

[01:41:14] the stand

[01:41:14] to go

[01:41:14] yes

[01:41:15] i require

[01:41:15] sustenance

[01:41:16] we're just

[01:41:17] absolute goofballs

[01:41:18] back and forth

[01:41:19] but yeah

[01:41:20] we just

[01:41:20] match each

[01:41:21] other's

[01:41:21] energy

[01:41:22] and oh that's great that you found just the small things oh yeah it's just the small things

[01:41:27] that brighten up the day and even if i'm just depressed or i'm gloomy or something like that

[01:41:32] just small little things like high fives yeah or fist bumps or just you know a hug

[01:41:40] just the little things always seem to help that's also hard on a partner's end because

[01:41:48] you were explaining to all of us before about the uh one of the characters and you can be on the

[01:41:55] outside with somebody that you love and you're just watching them fall apart you know what's wrong but

[01:42:00] you can't fix them and you're seeing them slowly slowly just eat away at whatever it is that's

[01:42:07] tormenting them that can be tough from someone who has a a spouse a partner a husband a wife or anybody

[01:42:16] a son a daughter and um they're dealing with this ptsd and you're seeing them struggling they're

[01:42:22] waking up in cold sweats and and all of this this anxiety and the things that you someone like that

[01:42:29] goes through and you're feeling helpless in a way and um out of control everything is just a little

[01:42:37] too far out of reach but i guess there are ways you can be supportive and like you said little high fives

[01:42:43] or she found probably things that were helpful and useful and to kind of get you back into not really

[01:42:50] lying but to show that there is someone supporting you when someone oh it was straight up just put me

[01:42:54] back in line really okay there it is like a real sergeant sometimes my tiny my tiny little platypus

[01:43:01] drill sergeant as it were i guess flying in a flying squirrel onesie sometimes but yeah but no she was

[01:43:08] she was definitely the rock that bonked me on the head and put me back into shape it was and a big i

[01:43:16] think a big honestly a big part of it was i found myself just wanting to be better uh for her and i

[01:43:23] think it's true for everybody when you find yourself wanting to improve for somebody else in a positive

[01:43:29] manner and it's not a relationship where you're hurting yourself for the expectations of someone else in a

[01:43:36] selfish nature then i i can only see it in a positive way so with with everything that was going on and

[01:43:45] it was just when i met her it was absolute just that's the one that like dibs and from then on it was just

[01:43:56] complete golden retriever energy on my part and i guess returned in the same in some ways that

[01:44:03] uh i got insanely lucky same as that you know that same as that sunrise very very fortunate and

[01:44:12] i'll be damned honest i deserve absolutely none of the luck or fortune i have and that's why i the only

[01:44:24] way i think of to you know pay it forward is to try and be as kind and to try and be as supportive and

[01:44:31] to try and be as welcoming as i can to anyone and everything you know regardless of creed belief

[01:44:39] ethnicity religion preference anything and as long as i think as long as i am that way maybe in some

[01:44:50] small like in my three-foot bubble maybe things can get a little better right um and maybe if i can

[01:44:58] take a little bit of that put it in the book form and they they spread their own little three-foot

[01:45:06] bubbles something else comes out of it who knows i'm not saying you know change the world but change

[01:45:15] a couple hearts change a couple minds maybe and entertain folks at the same time but i'll be writing

[01:45:21] the books either way because if i don't write the damn stories then they're all gonna get stuck inside

[01:45:27] my head and i'll have a migraine wow that's a that's an active imagination overly overly and i i mean i've

[01:45:36] got notes on almost 30 books now wow i could have just imagined there's there's uh there's papers lying

[01:45:43] around everywhere even on napkins there's some some a topic for a subject matter or a character

[01:45:49] it's not organized i'll tell you that right now i've got uh notebooks loose leaf paper i've got yellow

[01:45:55] paper pink paper it's there's it started as an organized color code system and then i got lazy

[01:46:03] and looking for the different color codes so now i just kind of doodle a mark on it how does that work

[01:46:08] out for you when you start to um sit down and and write out a few chapters or a few pages do you have

[01:46:14] to have like a corner that you go to um is there a certain i've got a tiny i've got a tiny little

[01:46:20] corner with uh you know i've got some of the books that i like to read um let's see what books do i

[01:46:26] have over here for inspiration to get the juices flowing well more like uh there are books that i've

[01:46:32] collected over the years that i really really like so i like to look at them or if i get bored i read

[01:46:36] them so i read a lot of uh john norman from the 1960s which is really cool and uh of course i've got

[01:46:45] fight club the original yeah tim o'bill line the things they carried uh a lot of history books

[01:46:51] i have uh eric von daniken's books like chariots of the gods why did it slip my mind i was trying to

[01:46:57] think of the author who's the author behind um for whom the bells toll oh that's fitzgerald right yes

[01:47:05] it is okay him he he was also someone who seen wartime and came back and started was it before

[01:47:12] after he started writing certain books and then some people say that his his writing style took a

[01:47:18] real turn after his deployment or after he was um it was after it was after yeah you could tell

[01:47:25] you could 100 tell he he should be i think a case study in psychological trauma 100 uh i would i would

[01:47:37] almost say then you have the great gatsby and that's another one oh gatsby is amazing yes yeah

[01:47:43] that's a beautiful story i'm sorry like if you're in high school and you have to read the gatsby you're

[01:47:48] going to suffer but if you're not going to get graded on it like enjoy it actually better you go watch

[01:47:54] leonardo dicaprio's the gatsby okay then go read the book that way you can judge the movie

[01:48:02] after you've read the book because then you you can take you know the imagery of the movie and put

[01:48:06] it onto the book and go wait a minute the movie sucked why didn't why didn't they have this

[01:48:14] oh gosh the flow i miss i miss the flow of great writers the flow the command of language the

[01:48:22] or shakespeare shakespeare is another where i loved and that's something i kind of i do i do

[01:48:31] and i only realized this after i i finished the first book uh and someone called me out on it one

[01:48:37] of my other friends who went you use uh a a double initiative pentameter for long-term descriptives

[01:48:47] whatever the term is and i've said what is that and she sent me a line and said who wrote this and i

[01:48:52] called that shakespeare and it's basically the tool that is like uh when you use a two or three

[01:49:00] words in a line that begin with the same letter that also have a same number of syllables so like a

[01:49:08] pilfered pitcher of pilsner yeah exactly it's fun to read and it's fun to write yeah i do that

[01:49:16] and i went i'm to me it's like fun it's fun i think it's great it's like it's kind of like a

[01:49:26] jokesty little like coy way of writing and even you read shakespeare othello no one talks about othello

[01:49:36] from shakespeare is what i think it's one of the raunchiest funniest plays he ever did but at the

[01:49:47] same time it it is so much tragedy for the main character othello and also for his his female

[01:49:59] opposite in that whole story that it drives directly into the heart of like internet like

[01:50:08] interracial relations how it's observed in not just back then but even now in many parts of the world

[01:50:15] and you can see the tension in between every line because when it's othello and his wife

[01:50:26] there's this warmth in the beginning in how just the the beat and the tempo that comes between them

[01:50:33] and then when it's othello and say a friend it it paces a little quicker and a little jumpy and

[01:50:39] it has a humor but as soon as othello is in that talking to the outside of his world it's very

[01:50:48] he inflates himself to show i'm not afraid of you and the crowd is jabbing

[01:50:54] even when they're nice they're very short very cut it's like every line every line othello receives

[01:51:04] is like a dagger almost like a verbal stab in his heart or back so i love the way he wrote and

[01:51:14] it's just you're never going to see anything like that ever again man with this this love this passion

[01:51:21] this enjoyment of the craft and everything with writing was this something can you recall prior

[01:51:27] to that that time around the towers when you were witnessing and seeing these inscriptions these

[01:51:34] old ancient artifacts that were written before that did you have any kind of drawing or or gravitation

[01:51:42] towards reading novels and uh just authors and the way that they would write or express themselves

[01:51:48] i know in college uh i was reading a lot i know i was reading a lot of the classics i know i was

[01:51:55] a constant bookworm i was addicted to it i think honestly the hardest part of osit was not being able to

[01:52:02] read anything other than the torah and then i got excited when someone handed me a quran because i had

[01:52:09] never read one before uh oh so you you weren't able to or i that probably just wasn't something that

[01:52:15] you wanted we were restricted we were restricted he was like you can only read uh army manuals or

[01:52:20] religious material you know said because i went are you kidding me no magazines oh you could read a

[01:52:27] newspaper but only at the staff duty desk i guess they didn't want you getting too caught up in your

[01:52:31] in your mind and get uh you know distracted from the no distractions so it was yeah daily torah

[01:52:39] readings with me and the only other jew that was in the company it was great when you had that that

[01:52:44] moment and you had that electric shock inside of you from seeing feeling in your mind's eye and

[01:52:51] feeling feeling the the energy and everything from that that moment when alexander the great once upon

[01:52:57] a time was marching through there oh it was a it was a car battery and in your mind you you said you

[01:53:03] were you were uh imagining these scenes in the scenarios after that these were things that you were

[01:53:09] constantly it was near constant i think like anytime any kind of downtime it was just back then it was

[01:53:16] more it was a jungle gym upstairs yeah it really was back then it was a little more rapid just everything

[01:53:21] was just it was like a floodgate opened and it ranged from just these fantastic worlds to what was more

[01:53:31] predominantly uh the history of the place and scenarios of ancient history but leaning more toward just the

[01:53:38] normal everyday people like uh normal soldiers on their normal it started off as just normal everyday

[01:53:45] soldiers in ancient history the ones that are not named the ones with names like um pigilus

[01:53:52] who came from thrace and had only ever held a spear once or twice in his life and died in his very first

[01:54:01] battle scared and alone crying for his mother stuff like that just the the nobodies of history i think

[01:54:08] is what i had dubbed them in my mental library and i would think about these nameless nobodies

[01:54:14] and what it must have been like for them to be in these momentous occasions in history and to never be remembered

[01:54:20] ever again or at all and then it ranged further and further into making these new worlds and then making histories of

[01:54:29] those worlds and cultures and other things and from over the next i think now 12 years

[01:54:36] that has slowly now become the full fleshed out world of what is becoming the basis of uh the books that i'm

[01:54:49] writing but you mentioned the writing on that tower i do remember one particular line i have no idea what it

[01:54:57] actually says but being another one of the guys pretty much surmised that it indicated a superior officer

[01:55:05] enjoying the accompanying of men because it was also had a doodle of an of what was clearly an officer

[01:55:14] with a plumed helmet performing an act with another officer which we think was alexander in a caricature

[01:55:23] and we were like looking at this going there were just two random guys who were probably on guard duty

[01:55:33] bored out of their minds and frustrated in the desert angry and one of them pulls a stick or their dagger out

[01:55:41] sits here on this because my buddy actually sat next to the tower and then put himself in a position

[01:55:48] and figured out where this guy could have sat to carve it so he was probably sitting exactly where

[01:55:56] this nameless dude and there was a rock behind him that was kind of uh i guess like sofa cushion shaped

[01:56:06] and he found like if he scooched his butt down he could lean back with a stick and write and carve it

[01:56:14] in a reclined position comfortably so it was almost like he was right there thousands of years ago or

[01:56:22] whatever where this soldier was writing this out and was just bored or frustrated or angry and put this

[01:56:30] graffiti message right there oh it was absolutely breathtaking just looking at i do remember that one

[01:56:39] dude no one has sat where you sat since alexander and he went and he just looked at me and went that's

[01:56:47] freaking cool i was like this is our this is rick this is archaeology you know national geographic would be

[01:56:57] absolutely horrified but that was cool that yeah from there you had so you have

[01:57:05] one if i'm not mistaken one book published now that's available and people can get it wherever they

[01:57:13] can find books sold yeah uh it is available on amazon and books a million barnes and noble and uh

[01:57:22] i can give you my link tree as well if they go through the link tree i have links to all the stores that

[01:57:29] it is available digitally there and if you've got kindle unlimited you can actually read it for free

[01:57:35] as well i prefer i've always preferred you know soft covers because you can you get that book smell i love

[01:57:42] the book smell yeah nothing like a book yeah and a physical copy that's cool yeah definitely share the

[01:57:50] link tree and and i will share the uh all that information in the show notes so anybody interested what what

[01:57:57] would somebody walk away with after reading there are a few um i think you could probably get i would

[01:58:05] say three things out of this one family is what you make of it not where you are coming from it's family is more

[01:58:17] than blood and number two would be just because you are having a problem be it mentally physically

[01:58:28] emotionally that doesn't mean it can keep you from achieving great things and the third would be

[01:58:38] life isn't always fair but that doesn't mean that you just stop and you don't move forward the overall

[01:58:47] and this is series wise the overall series tone is heroes don't appear on a white horse waving a magic sword

[01:58:58] or with a great mystical weapon with powers granted from the gods heroes are everywhere and you find them

[01:59:10] wherever you look heroes are the baker that bakes extra bread for the homeless they are the school teacher

[01:59:19] that takes extra time to teach that one child that is struggling they are the soldier that spares a

[01:59:31] wounded enemy and leaves them under some blankets until help arrives heroes are everyday men and women doing

[01:59:42] extraordinary things on normal days that's it wow that that you nailed it on the head and that's exactly

[01:59:55] the spirit and emphasis behind this show giants amongst us giants amongst us giants amongst us giants and by giants i do mean like the ordinary heroes or people that like you said you might brush past

[02:00:11] at the grocery store you might see at the gas pump and not think anything beyond that but they have a story they are doing something that is meaningful and it can be the smallest of things it could be the tallest of things but these are people that we may have overlooked in life but man

[02:00:32] and have they really left a print on humanity on the consciousness of humanity or just in their circle their immediate circle these aren't people you're going to see on the big screen these aren't people that

[02:00:45] you're going to um you're going to be told that you need to pay attention to this is an influencer right here this is a supposed star right here no these are ordinary folks that

[02:00:57] are doing something that is meaningful something that has value and like you said just taking that extra time

[02:01:06] and it really does mean something especially to the people that they're interacting with just on a normal day-to-day basis

[02:01:13] oh yeah i couldn't agree more it's i've yet to have a a major meaningful encounter with someone

[02:01:23] huge but you know i've got memories and meaningful encounters with just regular folks like you mean at the

[02:01:32] grocery store like you said or out on the street or actually most of them are at grocery stores i don't go to

[02:01:37] a lot of places mostly grocery stores i do like that especially i love i love where i live now i've got a

[02:01:44] normal grocery store so now it's kind of like oh hi again i do like that i kind of see the same bunch

[02:01:51] yeah i see the same folks so it's kind of nice it's real it's kind of nice where it's uh you've helped

[02:01:57] the same person get something off a top shelf one or two times even though you don't work there now it's

[02:02:01] kind of like oh hi again you know which one i need oh yeah okay i know that's your brand that's

[02:02:06] fine one of those kind of grocery stores it's nice okay yeah you you really nailed it with the the whole

[02:02:13] heroes and sometimes we're looking for a knight in shining army but man there's uh people all around us

[02:02:19] and uh especially like how you said this it's impactful in one way with the interactions that are

[02:02:25] shared because um that's also paying you forward and you know we're not talking about change the

[02:02:31] world i mean that's impossible but you can definitely impact and influence your small circle and if

[02:02:37] everybody were to do that i think that would just make things a little bit better overall oh yeah like

[02:02:44] we can't we can't do it like you said but i mean the world is made of three-foot circles change enough

[02:02:48] of three-foot circles and enough of the world will be okay maybe yeah we don't have to be perfect we

[02:02:57] just got to be okay i'll settle i'll settle for okay yeah um joseph campbell and and he's he was a real

[02:03:04] big a studier of mythologies and he put it i like the way he put it speaking of imperfections he said

[02:03:11] that we're in a constellation of imperfections oh yes and that we are we're works in progress and

[02:03:18] um yeah those three points those three takeaways for the book in general what someone could walk

[02:03:24] away with those are some very very very useful gems thank you and i'm definitely interested in

[02:03:32] that i'm gonna get a physical copy because like you i like the smell of a good book i'd like to feel a

[02:03:38] good book uh my maybe i'm getting a little too but you know what i mean like just a physical there's

[02:03:45] nothing like it yes well you've got my contact information so if you get it and you want it signed

[02:03:51] let me know and we'll hook you up on that absolutely so this is something that the juices are are flowing

[02:03:58] and this is a this is your outlet that your creative outlet to um couch words and to uh share

[02:04:06] fantasy reality all of it intertwined and and um letting it flow through poetic verses that pop out

[02:04:14] and punch somebody and and they move someone and and um really take them take them on for a ride so you

[02:04:21] have it's safe to say a few books or a few stories that are are also um under the wraps or i guess you're

[02:04:29] working on as we speak oh yeah well actually um i'm in the middle of a chapter right now uh for book two

[02:04:40] and if you like i can give your listeners a bit of a sneak peek for book two yeah yeah all right uh this

[02:04:48] is uh to give reference this is a line spoken by uh one character amongst three that are seated at a

[02:04:54] table in an open courtyard they're uh awaiting a a pending execution that is yet to be performed

[02:05:05] wondrous creatures dogs he watched the pack moving away slowly sniffing the ground in search of mere

[02:05:13] morsels they could be trained to hunt their noses seem able to sniff out even the most well-hidden quarry

[02:05:20] their speed is unmatched in the open or through streets and once one decides they're your friend

[02:05:26] there's no amount of harm one can do upon them that would convince them otherwise

[02:05:31] shaking his head slowly the dark-haired man sighed staring blankly into some unknown memory

[02:05:37] stupid damn beasts i love them the woman alongside snorted you're simply a coat of fur and a tail away

[02:05:46] from being one yourself diarlo by the fires you smell worse than that long-haired mutt did with

[02:05:52] practiced ease she eased the flat throwing knife back into the leather sheath amongst its friends tucked

[02:05:57] snugly under the cuff of her dress none would have ever guessed the freckled straw-haired woman had more

[02:06:02] knives on her at the present than the closest butcher as it were they were hidden at the present well

[02:06:08] one would have to become far more well acquainted with her to find out exactly where and just how many

[02:06:14] there were before that answer was given without finding out the answers one by one each was introduced

[02:06:20] with a twirl and a flick as they appeared from hiding like spring hairs amongst the reeds one should say

[02:06:25] oh wow that you you gotta you you have to also make it available maybe that's putting a little bit too much

[02:06:33] extra work into it but doing the audio book also i do have the audio recording software

[02:06:41] here i'm in the process of figuring out how royalty-free audios work and i'm putting together a soundboard

[02:06:52] because if i do eventually do it i think what i would like to do is finish the first quintology yeah i

[02:06:59] want to finish the first quintology the first four books in the series before i start doing the audio

[02:07:04] audiobooks that way if i do it i can do four audio books all at once and then as each quintology goes

[02:07:13] just do four audio books this is the new one that you're working on this is that was a quick excerpt from

[02:07:20] a little portion in the first chapter of book two okay a little teaser yeah the book two isn't i hope to

[02:07:29] have that one out by 2025 book two is going to be the banners of aurea and travels a much i can't really

[02:07:39] reveal too much because it carries on the story from book one does that entail just a whole lot of

[02:07:46] brainstorming before you start fleshing the whole story out or you put the bone you you kind of do the

[02:07:52] outline of it then you start adding the color and all that that's a crazy process i mean everybody

[02:07:58] probably has a different for me it was very i have a world i have a world scenario that is there so

[02:08:06] there's things that are happening within the world that absolutely no one had any kind of control or

[02:08:11] influence of like um natural disasters or the seasons and things like that or acts of the gods i would

[02:08:21] classify then there was the political landscape things that are happening at a national level

[02:08:29] within the realm of royal influence that the common people would not know about but would feel the effect

[02:08:36] and then i had the linear stories and how they connect to each other so you don't necessarily see

[02:08:45] a hundred percent of the picture but what things you do see you get the illusions of how it happened and

[02:08:54] why but just so you would see say someone gets murdered in an alleyway as an example from one point of view in

[02:09:03] the story you can be shown the murder the murderer the person who hired the murderer and a witness so

[02:09:12] already you've got four stories it's a matter of taking those four stories and how do you tell it

[02:09:19] so i'm taking just a murder in an alley top of my head you can tell the story as though it's a person

[02:09:26] coming home from a day of work you can tell the entire story of how his day at work went the

[02:09:32] ominousness of the night having to take the alley is a way home the sound of footsteps from behind the

[02:09:38] glint of steel and then the story ends with him bleeding out on the floor then you tell the story of

[02:09:44] the murderer and how he has been watching this person this entire day the movements and tracks the thrill of

[02:09:54] the hunt or the despair of having to do this for money however way you want to have the murderer or the assassin

[02:10:03] the pushing through the act itself what happens after because he survives and then the feeling of being

[02:10:13] seen and then you see a glimpse of the witness and then the witness found through you can get that whole

[02:10:21] scene of the witness and then the witness you give on their tail end of the story a normal day any other

[02:10:27] yada yada they are let's say drunk in a bar this most frightening thing happened and they as they

[02:10:35] are telling this story they are telling it to a friend of theirs and the friend leans back and has the memory

[02:10:43] of you don't say but they're the one who hired the murderer to kill this person in the alleyway

[02:10:49] so you can take all four of these people and you can make one full story out of four stories so

[02:10:58] for me it's kind of what is the core event how do i get there what events happen between who sees it

[02:11:09] and who's involved so i may have characters that do specific things but you won't necessarily

[02:11:16] follow them but you will know of them we may come back to them later in another book or somewhere else

[02:11:24] right but for the narrative of the story i only want to focus and and follow with you because to me

[02:11:36] when i'm coming through the story it's kind of like a tabletop role-playing game or dungeons

[02:11:41] the dragons are a narrative story okay where it's like i've i've brought you the reader along and we're

[02:11:48] just moving amongst this world invisible and unseen and i'm pointing out here they are let's watch

[02:11:58] walking us through the whole scenario as it unplates like uh scrooge yeah it's like we're we're

[02:12:04] scrooge and uh the ghost of christmas present i got you yeah it's kind of that feeling where you and

[02:12:12] the narrator are there watching this and you can move in amongst everyone and everything and feel it

[02:12:21] then you might snap your fingers and bam here we are over here in this side of the realm this is

[02:12:26] something i'm glad that that you also had as part of you know what we were over here sharing and what

[02:12:34] and what you were talking about was just the whole creative aspect also and you exploring that realm and

[02:12:40] you using your imagination and allowing all of these different experiences in life and then even things that

[02:12:48] you have just in your inner world and you're fleshing them out and putting them on paper but

[02:12:53] that i think can be encouraging to people because i had this talk uh not too long ago but it was just

[02:13:00] about the fact of how technology for all of its beauty and all of its grand we can also find ourselves

[02:13:08] if we're not careful where we're outsourcing all of our abilities our creative abilities our intuition

[02:13:16] anything that makes us human and um that that special ingredient that that makes us a living soul

[02:13:25] and spirit with all of these things going on inside of us but we can outsource it to something like a

[02:13:31] smartphone or just any kind of device that has the ability now to do it for us so if we need to write

[02:13:39] a if we want to write a paper let's shave let's say for instance you go ahead and have chat gpt write an

[02:13:45] article for you and i want it to sound like fitzgerald and a little bit of shakespeare or whatever it is

[02:13:52] if you're draw if you're a drawer or if you do things with a camera if you even make music you can just

[02:13:59] have this device do it for you i guess you might just put in a few prompts and there you have it while i can

[02:14:06] hear especially with uh music you can hear especially if it's a music that has say yeah an ai voice with it

[02:14:17] you can hear when it is written the lyrics 100 there was a there's one what does it go suno ai

[02:14:26] uh not trying to plug it or anything my my buddy was messing around with it he was using it

[02:14:33] to write beats and he was trying to figure out how to do just the instrumentals on it because he didn't

[02:14:42] have a saxophone and he was trying to get this thing to do saxophone parts so he could take that

[02:14:51] and put it in with his track that he was making for his music so as i was messing around with that

[02:14:56] i had the thought of uh what if i write the song myself with vocals and tell it here are the lyrics

[02:15:07] well after i think two hours of plugging commands into this thing and i overpowered it enough to the

[02:15:17] point where i got it to actually do something bent to my will because i don't think ai has gotten to the

[02:15:26] point where it will achieve the human vision no it will it will do what it thinks you want or it will do

[02:15:36] things that are popular and trending according to algorithms on social media yeah because you can tell

[02:15:46] you can say give the prompt with the same lyrics and it will crank out 20 different songs but they all sound

[02:15:53] the same there won't be no variety there will be no variety with it unless you go in there and you

[02:16:02] physically tell it to do it in certain ways and that's what i had to do in order to get it to sound

[02:16:08] the way i wanted it to sound were you impressed with the final product uh kind of a little bit i

[02:16:15] you i wound up using i wound up using it in a youtube series videos that i'm doing for like a digital

[02:16:20] library on cartography oh okay and yeah that was just more for me and it was just a fun little project

[02:16:27] for uh like fantasy world making cartography yeah and that's also on the link tree but that's just a

[02:16:35] fun project the uh what was the other the chat chat gpt writing stories read to me like a 14 year old on

[02:16:46] tumblr i haven't tested it out but i've or actually probably there might who knows who knows what

[02:16:53] you're coming across sometimes when you're looking at articles online now some of them might just be

[02:16:57] chat gpt and you don't even know it but i would argue that uh if you're seeing articles in a major

[02:17:05] newspaper or on a website and you have the same author of the article on more than four articles

[02:17:12] a day in a paper then it is most likely going to be ai because and i'm not going to discredit the

[02:17:22] author for any of the papers that that's happening i will however go after the the managers and the

[02:17:31] publicists and things like that because those are the ones that are going after these reporters and

[02:17:35] giving them deadlines on what should be in-depth news stories and saying you have two hours to write

[02:17:42] a half-page article on an international incident in the sedan yeah that's ridiculous oh and by the way

[02:17:51] i also need a half-page article on women's fashion clothing and a excerpt article interview on

[02:17:59] the mar-a-lago golf course finals okay that's three subjects of this reporter yeah oh and i need it by

[02:18:09] tomorrow morning there's no there there's three different subjects that this reporter knows

[02:18:14] nothing about of course they're going to use something to save themselves because when you're

[02:18:19] living in new york paying 18 grand a month for a one red run bedroom apartment and the bathroom is on

[02:18:25] the first floor and you're on the 18th then you're going to use every trick in the trade to try and

[02:18:32] make your life a little bit easier so you can go spend 45 for a coffee in the morning yeah and and most of

[02:18:39] those those uh publishing companies or those magazines that just tells you they they really aren't looking

[02:18:46] for the truth or anything of value they just want to put this thing out asap and um whatever's trending

[02:18:52] but it has nothing to do with i want this to be in depth and we we have to sort out the facts and we

[02:18:59] have to give something that's coming from an unbiased place or anything like that that's out man though

[02:19:05] it's like uh the meme from the what was the movie journalistic integrity no gosh never heard of it

[02:19:14] yeah the was the movie troy the scene where uh achilles has that little quip with the king

[02:19:23] imagine a king that fights his own battles wouldn't that be a sight there's all the memes where it's uh

[02:19:27] where all it ends with is wouldn't that be a sight and the top part always changes imagine a reporter who

[02:19:33] told the truth wouldn't that be a sight imagine a newspaper that actually researched their articles

[02:19:39] wouldn't that be a sight oh yeah the possibilities are endless yeah you can fit that into everything

[02:19:48] it is nuts i guess one last thing you can probably also tell is another thing that's helped me immensely

[02:19:53] is just humor uh joking around humor comedy has helped um yeah uh george carlin george carlin is probably

[02:20:03] my favorite comedian comedian of all time lewis black he was george carlin is my spirit animal the man

[02:20:12] should have been president

[02:20:15] and and so much of it he was it was yes it was reality he was giving it to you straight this is how

[02:20:24] it is a lot of the times and i'm gonna i'm gonna be sarcastic and in a bit humorous with a

[02:20:31] a little black pepper over it he really was george carlin's the whole comedy style i've shown george

[02:20:37] carlin to younger generations of folks now and they won't laugh and i'll look at him go why aren't you

[02:20:43] laughing this dude's hilarious and their whole reaction to it is it sounds like a lecture

[02:20:50] what are you talking about he's just mean shut up

[02:20:56] lewis black is another great one he's losing his i love watching the man fall apart in real time

[02:21:06] because like lewis black's a comedian that when i watch him i can never tell if he actually came on

[02:21:12] stage that night with an idea of what he was gonna say oh just winging it she's just going i don't i

[02:21:19] honestly think him and cat williams wherever the muse yeah cat williams is another i think cat williams

[02:21:25] honestly just goes up with a cue card in his pocket with three or four things that happened that week

[02:21:32] that might be that might be it who is there is someone there was one of the bigger comedians and

[02:21:39] they stay they say something similar it's not like they're freestyling it but they have a couple of

[02:21:45] main main points and they just once they get on stage and then they get the read of the crowd and

[02:21:52] and how the the whole atmosphere is i guess in that auditorium or even in that small room that

[02:21:59] it just starts forming and they're they're able to just build and and um put in all of those extra

[02:22:07] details on the fly it's not gabriel eglasius he has a no no it's uh i i want to say no can't be dave

[02:22:17] chappelle it might be dave chappelle yeah because somebody was asking him about do you so do you write

[02:22:23] these jokes and do you have like say someone for instance like if if you want to say he's a comedian

[02:22:30] or just a podcaster and does a lot of other things but joe rogan he also does comedy but he

[02:22:35] has a formula where he writes everything out and i i think he just constantly once it's finally

[02:22:43] fleshed out and he says this is going to be my bit after working it out that he goes off of that

[02:22:49] whole structure that he writes out and it was a comedian he was speaking with and they were saying

[02:22:54] no no i i i don't write any of it out like that this is mostly uh i guess an organic conversation

[02:23:01] that's coming out on the fly depending on the mood or or the crowd another one he i only just found this

[02:23:09] guy i have no idea how long he has been on the circuit but i know very recently he wound up on

[02:23:16] america's got talent so he has to be new um i know his name's learn more uh he was on he was on

[02:23:28] the he was on chuckle bucket recently and he's been all over tiktok oh uh learn more yanazi it sounds

[02:23:37] familiar he's from i think he's from africa he does a joke about a chicken what is a chicken

[02:23:44] cross the road he was making he was making fun no no no no no better i swear better he was talking about

[02:23:52] um when he came to america and he was looking at all the chicken that was in the american grocery

[02:23:58] stores saying um this chicken is cruelty free and organic it's like i don't care about the chicken

[02:24:07] our chickens look like they have seen some shit our chickens look like they are going through a

[02:24:12] divorce and have drug problems but we still eat them all right he is he's one of those guys that

[02:24:22] he is so real and has this giant smile he he gives off this energy that you know just sitting in a room

[02:24:31] with him will make your day better because i know when he shows up on my tiktok feed i i stop everything

[02:24:38] and i just watch because it just makes me feel better i can have a bad day i can have a bad day and i hear

[02:24:45] that i hear that voice with his accent and i go this is going to be good i don't care what it is i'm going to

[02:24:51] listen you know and he never disappoints oh yeah so i just looked him up learn more janazi

[02:24:57] probably have seen him but i'm gonna have to look look it up he is if i have the right yeah

[02:25:03] up and coming brand new he is absolutely hilarious that's the one of the oldest

[02:25:13] natural medicines they say is is humor laughter that's good for the heart that's good for the

[02:25:19] so that's good for the the overall well-being of somebody even a lot of those comics they come from

[02:25:25] dark places and that's that's how they were able to deal with you know all of the things that they

[02:25:30] were doing yeah carlin was perfect example he he went through major major stuff even weirdo yankovic

[02:25:39] who does the parody music he went through horrible stuff committee oh yeah i don't know his backstory

[02:25:46] weird owl not not going off of the movie uh that was made that's a parody movie weirdo yankovic from

[02:25:54] interviews that he's done he was always you know the weird kid bullied as a kid just mocked he was just

[02:25:59] the the weirdo outcast never really had stability inside the home when it came to his own interests

[02:26:07] was always just kind of ostracized with his own family off of it but by the time he started going

[02:26:15] off into college and he just kind of was one of the weirdo goofy kids he was looked at you know just as

[02:26:21] the weirdo goofy kid but once he started actually embracing the image and becoming later known as weird

[02:26:28] owl and doing the strange polka music then he found his niche and that's kind of where it is so for

[02:26:36] him it was more he never had a place in the home outside the home so he was always just looking for

[02:26:43] something and now he has it then yeah what doesn't kill you make you he embraced it and it became his

[02:26:52] superpower yeah he was great i don't think there's ever been someone in comedy that can go on a stage

[02:27:03] and go i come from a stable home with a mother and a father who both love me very much period i don't

[02:27:09] think i i can actually also just put it this way to even go broader there is no comedian i have ever

[02:27:16] seen come on stage that says i have come from a stable upbringing period like none oh yeah no you're

[02:27:24] right because the majority i mean if i i can't say across the board but i mean it probably is a safe

[02:27:31] bet but i know for a fact that all that i've i've watched and that i've i've i've seen interviews

[02:27:38] and heard some of them tell those tell their story and talk about their the some of their their

[02:27:43] upbringing or just how it was for them before they hit the big scene or started doing comedy

[02:27:49] professionally yeah they they've come from a dark place they a lot of them even say that they say

[02:27:55] that's that's where the humor it comes from a dark place yep because what i was gonna point out is

[02:28:00] whenever they do talk about it i've i don't know memory of any of the comedians that i've seen speak

[02:28:07] on the matter take pity on themselves for it they're always laughing about it exactly they will constantly

[02:28:14] they comedians will make the good comedians the greats will make more jokes about themselves and

[02:28:22] their own misfortunes than anyone so there's a in judaism there's in the jewish culture there's this

[02:28:27] very common turn of phrase and tenet of if one can not make jokes and poke fun at themselves then

[02:28:34] what humor and joy can you find in the rest of the world like if you can't laugh at yourself can you

[02:28:41] laugh at anything oh i like that i really like that it's so you can take it a few different ways but

[02:28:47] that's kind of something i've always looked at i've tried to laugh at different things i try to

[02:28:52] find humor in it now of course you know this as well as anyone being military would we tend to make

[02:28:57] jokes about well things like what are you going to do this weekend i'm going to go suck start a

[02:29:02] shotgun and then and everyone just kind of looks at it go huh me too i'll join you that but no one means

[02:29:10] it yeah but when you're i guess in that culture in the military that kind of a humor is the norm

[02:29:18] and when someone stops making that joke that's when you get worried it's very strange that

[02:29:30] that became the culture when someone's joking about harming themselves that simply became an indicator of

[02:29:39] oh they're not doing okay and no one thought anything of it but as soon as they get quiet and say

[02:29:46] nothing not even i'm okay don't talk to me nothing they just get quiet that's when you get worried

[02:29:53] withdrawn yeah exactly it's like we're talking about the fella before when uh before we start

[02:30:00] recording the guy that went to basic with we never would have thought because he was just talking

[02:30:07] with his platoon like normal so the fact that he went and did something shocked everybody

[02:30:14] yeah that's what you you hear that also with people that they say you know the let's just if we're talking

[02:30:20] about um suicide and and the ones that are always talking about it like they're you know those are the

[02:30:26] ones that that usually are maybe i mean i'm not saying all the time but maybe they're just seeking

[02:30:32] attention attention and it's a cry for help they're loud about it they're very boisterous but then you

[02:30:37] have the other ones that don't say anything and those are the ones that actually end up pushing a

[02:30:43] line all the way and there's many uh there's many that when they're as you say vocal that's one of the

[02:30:50] only ways that they can think of or they have found to actually get help or attention and sometimes all

[02:30:57] they really need is someone to talk to and talk them down and the way i've seen it a few times the

[02:31:04] very common one is when you are in that position where you're in between few choices and one of those

[02:31:14] choices is i would call the choice of finality uh when you're going to follow through with the plan

[02:31:20] or at the very least an act simply having some anyone it could be a stranger it could be someone

[02:31:28] you don't even like come out and say dude don't do it or girl don't do it just simply those three

[02:31:38] words is enough to pull you off of that ledge and put the gun back in the drawer it's really that simple

[02:31:45] because it's an affirmation of worth and a lot of times that's all someone needs sometimes it's not

[02:31:52] even thoughts of suicide it's thoughts of am i worth it am i worth being around am i do i have value

[02:32:03] so the way you test that boundary to see if you have value is you propose the idea of removal

[02:32:08] so to see if you have value to anybody it doesn't matter who you voice the thought and depending on

[02:32:19] that response on the out the outside is going to within within yourself either confirm or reject the

[02:32:29] idea that yeah i do have value or i guess nobody does give a damn right but it's counterintuitive

[02:32:37] because and i had this conversation with someone who who made who made this uh act multiple times

[02:32:46] it was a young young man who is another non-commissioned officer soldier who the other

[02:32:55] non-commissioned officer used the phrase cry wolf and i had a conversation with that person and said

[02:33:00] listen we can't treat it that way because the one time that we ignore it is going to be the time

[02:33:08] he does it so i'm going to go talk with him and i sat the guy i sat the young man down he was very

[02:33:15] young 19 freshly married kid on the way the worst possible case i could have imagined for me to try and

[02:33:24] have this conversation said listen it doesn't matter if he likes you or not it doesn't matter if anyone

[02:33:30] around here thinks you're valuable or not because it doesn't matter what they say it doesn't matter what

[02:33:36] they think anything what matters is do you value yourself and he said no i said wrong answer

[02:33:46] because if you did not value yourself you would have done something already you clearly do so i know

[02:33:54] you value yourself so stop lying to yourself and accept the fact that you do have value and you need

[02:34:02] to tell yourself you have value because deep down you do and i had to i had to get tough with them

[02:34:10] sometimes you do this is 100 not something i would have done with anyone else this was the one percent

[02:34:23] time that i would have ever sat down with someone this way one percent and i know

[02:34:32] when i was in those dark places that if someone had sat down with me like that it would have thrown

[02:34:37] me over the edge because i had not gotten to that point or i was i should say i was well beyond that i

[02:34:43] had truly no value of myself when i had gotten to that point but with him it was completely different

[02:34:50] because everyone's depression cycle to the point of removal does present differently for him

[02:34:58] it works fortunately he's stable he's now a non-commissioned officer

[02:35:05] and he is also now uh one of the instructors for the suicide awareness program which i think is

[02:35:15] incredible right there you go you're talking about making making an impact on your three feet of

[02:35:22] and it goes further i couldn't have asked for anything more for me it was more for me i was selfish at

[02:35:28] the time because all i was thinking was i don't want any more phone calls at two in the morning

[02:35:34] that's really where that was me hmm really at the time i was yeah you mean honest if i'm being yeah i'm

[02:35:42] being dead honest i was thinking i don't want any more phone calls at two in the morning i don't want

[02:35:47] this to be an issue anymore i don't want this to i'm not sugarcoating it i was really just

[02:35:51] tired of this but it works out in the end because now like i'm real proud of this guy

[02:35:57] you know a few years down the road and he's really turned it around so you never know

[02:36:03] what someone's future value so it's just like the stock think of human beings like stocks you can

[02:36:12] invest a little bit of time now and watch it grow just a little you don't have to you can put five

[02:36:21] minutes of your time into someone right now wait 10 years and see what happens

[02:36:28] exactly you never have an idea like what what these people are capable of it's absolutely incredible

[02:36:36] you plant a seed and that seed is not going to turn into an oak tree overnight but throughout time and

[02:36:44] and throughout experience and throughout life that one seed that was planted there's other things that

[02:36:50] are going on that are watering it watering it watering it watering it and eventually it turns and

[02:36:55] manifests into something great but it was from that one seed and it wasn't in vain right a lot of times

[02:37:03] it's not in vain and if we think that way of like you said that there's a that story and you hear it

[02:37:11] sometimes where there's somebody that's down and out down in the dumps and i could even say for myself

[02:37:16] or i'm sure you've been there but there were times where you're just in a dark place and you're

[02:37:22] you uh you you had it up to um your neck and you just feel like just throwing in the towel you know

[02:37:28] there's pointless it's useless um you know i'm just a piece of shit or however you're feeling and then you

[02:37:34] have something happen uh maybe it's a sunrise uh that just pops out and grabs your attention or it's

[02:37:41] somebody that's walking by and they just say you know hey how's it going or uh whatever it is but

[02:37:47] that one moment and that one instance uh uh from a stranger someone that you'll never see again who

[02:37:54] knows it's like that that old saying where they they uh they say always be mindful of who you're

[02:38:01] you're speaking with and dealing with because you may be entertaining an angel and um so yeah that can

[02:38:08] really do something at that moment at that time and um make a huge difference to where years later this

[02:38:17] person still remembers it it can go go back and recall yeah i do remember when i was at the gas

[02:38:23] station and i was just about ready to just drive through a divider or something but then the clerk

[02:38:29] said something nice or something kind or you know someone bumped into me and they they uh just gave me

[02:38:35] some words of encouragement just out of the blue and that really made the difference oh yeah

[02:38:42] i think there's a there's a anime that uh my wife watches my hero academia i think it was yeah

[02:38:49] there's a a line there i know it's out of context i am here

[02:38:56] that's just if you say that to yourself i am here if you're still here you're winning

[02:39:02] every day you drop breath every step you take is a win everyone's out everyone else is out here

[02:39:09] trying to run marathons i'm having a staring eye contest that's right that that's my athletic

[02:39:16] prowess yeah every day is a new day to the wise man absolutely true gotta love it uh it's or another

[02:39:24] i guess another book i don't have it up here actually where is it oh it's too big that's why

[02:39:29] meditations by marcus aurelius oh marcus aurelius the stoicism the best part he never meant for anyone

[02:39:38] to read it yeah it was a journal just his own personal journal that's right people you get to

[02:39:45] read a roman emperor's private trauma journal imagine that all right that it's not boring

[02:39:52] this man didn't want he didn't want anyone to read it he was very self-critical on himself you want

[02:40:00] i just imagine like so what i like to do when i read that i actually i put on uh my on spotify i put

[02:40:06] on my early 2000s emo teenager uh mix so like i have from the background where are you and i'm so

[02:40:16] sorry and i just imagine marcus with like the black combed down emo toga in his room with like

[02:40:23] eel emo band poster paintings on the wall in his journal going i'm such bad emperor i can't do

[02:40:33] anything right you think he's so horrible you think he was having some uh yeah some dried crushed

[02:40:40] grapes in a in a nice in a chalice and he was drinking that as he wrote he's bad yeah he's just

[02:40:45] doing bad his his uh his advisors are knocking on the door sorry i need to work go away i'm in my room

[02:40:51] gone uh going gone and you hear a lot of those like that this is from whatever it was it was

[02:41:02] documented or said to have been written but there's even a lot of uh you see religious passages that

[02:41:08] have those same similarities in in um phrases in just statements but that's a good book i have i

[02:41:18] have it and it's worn out it's all worn out there's mustard stains on it coffee stains on it it's been

[02:41:24] through everything i'll take it to the bus stop to the guarantee there were yeah there were stains on

[02:41:29] the original too i guarantee it like 100 his was probably crumbled and destroyed yeah i i bet there

[02:41:38] were more he probably tried to burn it a couple times he had there's a there's another one uh

[02:41:44] epititis um there's a few people oh the epitaphs there you go yeah and um the cynics the cynics they

[02:41:50] think that's where it originated from the school of cynicism or school of cynicism those were some wild

[02:41:56] ones yeah i'm trying oh man that reminded me just random squirrel thought moment who was it that

[02:42:03] there were two philosophers oh it was oh i draw i think it was androgyny's and plato had this whole

[02:42:12] beef and plato uh and androgyny's were would constantly have these arguments which by the

[02:42:19] way plato was not this real wasn't always this really old like dude when he was younger he was

[02:42:25] a wrestler so when he would lose an argument he would actually drag the other philosopher outside

[02:42:31] and they would wrestle oh yeah you know what i've heard of that yeah crap out of them yeah he would

[02:42:36] he would fight people when he was upset at losing an argument he would wrestle him in the street then

[02:42:41] he would walk back in and go i won and no one would argue with him so i don't know how great of a

[02:42:49] philosopher he is if he's losing and giving a wrestling match but anyway so i think asrogyny's later when

[02:42:54] so plato said something along the lines of men came from chickens and it is something to do with

[02:43:04] uh for we are beings that walk upon two legs and that uh we only go about our days seeking the basic

[02:43:12] necessities for we are like chickens and da da da da so the next day this other philosopher and i i think

[02:43:18] as a draw knees it could be someone else came in with a live chicken that he had ripped all the feathers

[02:43:24] off of and threw it up in the middle of the philosopher's circle and said behold his human

[02:43:32] and this is just this was this was educate this was the education system back in case this was

[02:43:40] this is how argue this is philosophy right now congratulations this is the birth of western

[02:43:46] civilization a plucked chicken yeah can't argue that all right that's cool and there you have it and

[02:43:55] we're talking in years later thousands of years later these are still people that we reference

[02:44:03] and go back to from time to time when we're trying to sort out some things that are going on in our own

[02:44:11] lives i mean i'm more than happy to go ahead and revisit the chicken theory we're spending federal

[02:44:18] dollars on other stuff yeah no no you're right there's a now it's like uh what is it it's the

[02:44:25] the the clowns are in charge of the circus oh yeah that's great breads and circus bread and

[02:44:32] circuses there's nothing new going back to that nothing new under the moon oh man where was it

[02:44:38] it was i think it was a couple years ago uh the i think it was the informant was a newspaper they

[02:44:45] had a a cartoonist did a big political cartoon it was an nfl stadium with a bunch of fast food

[02:44:53] restaurants around it and it had in greek or roman letters above it bread and circuses oh that's

[02:45:00] all and it was just it was brutal that's all it had and it's just an nfl stadium with fast food

[02:45:08] restaurants around it bread and circuses wow and i can't i think it was the informer and a

[02:45:13] the washington informer that is i think it was it was a brutal brutal little piece

[02:45:22] i wish i remembered which artist did that it was just sometimes you get these political commentary

[02:45:29] cartoons that are put that on a bumper sticker yes i would wear it as a t-shirt

[02:45:34] that is a t-shirt there you go yeah i'm sure if i'm sure there's gotta be a way to pull it up there

[02:45:40] so you can pull up almost everything that's been put into the cloud or not even put into the cloud

[02:45:47] just so many things you can just type up and um they have archives of it logos and

[02:45:53] yeah that would be a good t-shirt a good bumper sticker that would be a good book bookmark uh

[02:46:00] everything a coffee mug oh it would be absolutely amazing because even still i've got it i've got my

[02:46:08] my image finder in the background and it is stripped literally i type in political cartoon nfl stadium

[02:46:17] bread and circuses and under images there's only 20 results uh you know what they they they scrub it

[02:46:27] purged it has been purged the only things that i can even find when i expand the search results are

[02:46:37] recreate recreations off of uh say reddit and facebook that's it that means that's how good it was

[02:46:46] and that's the other thing going back to how you have a let's just say a physical copy uh the option

[02:46:53] to get a physical copy of your book only because you know there are cases now and it's not a surprise

[02:46:59] it's probably been going on for longer than these current days but um where people uh let's say for

[02:47:07] instance you have an old book a classic book or something it could be the great gaspy and then you

[02:47:12] you decide so you know what i want to go ahead and get it on audio file and uh download it and it's

[02:47:18] either gone or it could be that the book and the story and the words have been changed around and

[02:47:26] it's not even the original copy it's it's a it's been tampered with and so you don't now you have

[02:47:34] the physical copy and then you can compare it with somebody oh i have this ebook right here and you

[02:47:39] compare i'm not saying all books but there are cases of it and i'm sure that with the the push to

[02:47:46] more things going ebook and being audio for not audio friendly but to to be down pdf file friendly

[02:47:54] or to be able to have it and read it on a a smart device or e-kendo or a kobo whatever it is that

[02:48:01] um that that can later on in life you know there's no more physical copies like how you had a once

[02:48:08] once upon a time with some of these country uh countries civilizations over wars and you have the

[02:48:14] burning of books you get rid of the books and now you rewrite the history it was uh i think it was

[02:48:20] a it was an austrian philosopher i can't remember the name i know it was central to eastern europe

[02:48:31] wrote something along the lines of the greatest threat to any totalitarian government is an educated

[02:48:37] populace exactly in order to exert the power over a people one must ensure you've controlled their

[02:48:45] thoughts and their minds once you control that then you can control their protections and if you look

[02:48:54] at a certain little country later on down the road the first thing they did was they went after the

[02:48:59] education system and they changed what the parameters were of education then they went after methods of

[02:49:07] protection and hunting and then they went after the economic structure and before people knew it

[02:49:14] it was complete totalitarian regime yeah and the is a frightening frightening condition that repeated

[02:49:27] itself and a lot of people look at that scenario and say well that was just that was just there it

[02:49:33] happened several several several more times in a bunch of other countries and everyone seemed shocked

[02:49:39] that they this government or that government was able to get away with it would happen here

[02:49:45] that's always the reaction it is something that will repeat itself continuously uh but yeah i appreciate it

[02:49:54] like um and if folks want to uh get the book and reach out and you guys enjoy it then please do it uh

[02:50:03] it is on goodreads as something i think my wife put it up on goodreads you can also like do reviews on it and

[02:50:09] stuff like that you can review it on amazon and things like that if you guys like it and you know be honest

[02:50:15] if you think it's a one-star book put a one star like you can you can write i don't like it it made me

[02:50:21] feel sad one star there we go it's uh or if you love the book and you want to give it a higher rating

[02:50:27] then please do really appreciate it it's been out since uh august i've been talking with some

[02:50:33] friends that uh i had deployed with and served with i gave them my author advanced copies like the five

[02:50:40] or six advanced copies and so far they read it my brother-in-law funny enough i gave him an advanced

[02:50:45] copy and he wrote me back recently and said are you okay and i said no what are you talking about

[02:50:50] yeah i'm reading the book yeah it's okay you can read the book he's like this is this is horrible

[02:50:58] i'm sad but he and his girlfriend seem to enjoy it which is it's always nice to hear but hear back

[02:51:05] from folks on it that they're they're enjoying the stories but to take folks on little adventures you

[02:51:12] know kind of escape uh in some small amount and go somewhere else um is nice but to also remember

[02:51:21] that once you eventually do have to put the book down and come back but maybe maybe in some small way

[02:51:28] there's there's things in the book that will make you think about things in the real world in a different

[02:51:33] way yeah very applicable it sounds like yeah if anything if or if anything you get the impression

[02:51:39] that the person that wrote it that i i understand where you may be coming from and i can put things

[02:51:47] into words in a more digestible way so then you can maybe grab it and say hey you know how i'm always

[02:51:56] having this issue and i've not and you're you're not really grasping what it feels like read this

[02:52:02] maybe maybe that can be a way to use it as well yeah awesome man benjamin this this conversation we

[02:52:10] we went on a lot of different um back alleyways and side streets and twi uh twists and turns but but it

[02:52:18] was it was great to get your perspective and i know that's just a little touch of of what's going on

[02:52:24] what has went on with you but man it's it's always a a beautiful thing to hear even though we're we're

[02:52:31] strangers up until now but uh through this conversation just to hear that you're in a better

[02:52:35] place considering everything that you've been through and that that emphasis that you put on

[02:52:41] not being and it's not even to downplay things that you go through in life but just that you're not

[02:52:48] having that victim mentality you're not in defeat maybe at one time yes but there comes a time like

[02:52:58] with the new waking moment and a new waking day that you can make a decision you know what i'm not

[02:53:03] going to be that way anymore and i'm not going to have that attitude or i'm not going to behave this

[02:53:09] way and i'm going to change either my habits or my my uh thought process or whatever it is to start

[02:53:15] coming out of this a better person and uh just to try to make the best of of life's experience

[02:53:21] and what you have today and moving forward oh yeah 100 that is definitely where i'm coming into

[02:53:30] yeah before we wrap this up i felt like we could have went another three hours but just on just on

[02:53:36] oh wow i just held the time yeah we really wrote this one out but um yeah you have any any uh

[02:53:43] final words or anything you'd like to say before we we wrap it up no matter where you're at right now

[02:53:48] or how deep a hole there is there's always a rope to grab it's just a matter of how you're going to use

[02:53:54] it and it's always a better place if you're not alone the trick is recognizing you've never been

[02:54:04] alone whether or not that's a person whether or not it's a deity or it's simply the voices in your head

[02:54:12] screaming at you never to give up there are things at play outside of your control

[02:54:21] but you just have to accept it roll with the punches just because you might be knocked down

[02:54:29] you're never gonna go out you are a boxer in your own fight but you're not the one that gets to

[02:54:37] choose to throw in the towel just yet go until the bell rings do the full five rounds get back up and

[02:54:45] start swinging that's all you can do love it love it that's it that's the spirit that's the fighting

[02:54:53] spirit that's the human resilient spirit man it's been great benjamin appreciate it and all the best

[02:55:00] to you and yours you as well thank you so much for having me it's been fantastic touche keep fighting

[02:55:10] that good fight i hope you guys enjoyed that conversation as much as i enjoyed listening to

[02:55:17] benjamin talk about a lot of his life's experiences what shaped him what molded him and what formed him

[02:55:24] into the person that he is today healthier at peace with himself he has joy he has purpose he has love

[02:55:32] around him he has meaning he has light and he comes from a dark place he's been through the fire

[02:55:40] battle tested a complete blackout disconnecting him from his childhood memories but then going on to

[02:55:48] being deployed two times overseas serving for the u.s military and then coming home after seeing

[02:55:54] close friends of his being killed in battle after losing friends after seeing the death the despair the

[02:56:01] chaos the depravity all of the destruction that is of war coming back home and the reaction from society

[02:56:08] and friends family cold distance nonchalant about it benjamin had a lot to deal with a lot of battle

[02:56:17] scars a lot of battle wounds not just physically but internally and boy after all that how he was able to

[02:56:26] change his mentality how he was able to take back control and not hold on to that victim card he was able to

[02:56:34] see that there was still something within him that he was able to grasp build on and use to change his

[02:56:41] perspective in the way that he looked at life the way that he interacted with people the way that he

[02:56:46] engaged with the world writing played a big part writing was therapeutic he was able to express his

[02:56:53] traumatic events in fictitious form but with a lot of reality with the storylines behind what he was

[02:57:00] writing the characters the experiences and for those of you interested the name of the book again is

[02:57:07] hero of oriah and that's written by benjamin osgood his links the link tree is going to be in the show

[02:57:14] notes so you can click on that link tree and you can find out where to get your hands on that book you

[02:57:19] can find out how to reach out to him if you just want to send him some warm words or to keep in touch

[02:57:25] with him to see what else he has in the pipeline and under wraps he's a creative spirit he's got a love

[02:57:31] for writing he's got a love for expression and he shared a lot of that with us during your

[02:57:36] conversation and also a huge huge thing in his life when he said his backbone the wind behind him is his

[02:57:44] wife his loving wife his supportive wife who at times is like a drill sergeant giving it to him

[02:57:51] straight keeping him in line behind every good man is a good woman iron sharpens iron when you have

[02:57:58] that support when you have that love like he said you need that we need that as people we need that

[02:58:04] support and that love that someone from the outside who believes in us when we don't see it in ourselves

[02:58:09] to help remind us at times when we lose track or lose focus of who we are what we're capable of doing

[02:58:15] and that's a big reason why i enjoy doing this podcast because i've been blessed enough to meet people from

[02:58:21] everywhere different corners and pockets of the globe and we've been able to connect and talk story

[02:58:27] and with that i'm able to share them with you across from me to remind you that these stories and those

[02:58:33] people aren't the exception you're able of doing the same thing henry ford said whether you think you

[02:58:40] can or you can't you're right what's your mentality benjamin today reminded us of the fact that we're

[02:58:47] able to pull ourselves up out of the darkness we're able to do good things we're able to do great

[02:58:52] things we're able to change our perspective and change our three-foot circle that's how you change

[02:58:58] the world you're changing your world your immediate circle of influence who you are it's got to start

[02:59:05] from within and if anything hit home for you follow the show notes check out his link tree and reach out

[02:59:11] to him and let him know how much you appreciated his story and his words benjamin all the best to you

[02:59:17] keep fighting that good fight my friend you are a giant amongst us a big thank you to everybody on the

[02:59:27] other end listening it was great to share another story i hope you all enjoyed it on the other end

[02:59:32] you know how to get in touch with us it's giantsamongstus.org o-r-g we're gonna keep doing

[02:59:39] this we're gonna keep connecting we're gonna keep talking story and we're gonna keep highlighting the

[02:59:46] resilience human spirit in order to wake up the giants that may be dormant inside of you to keep

[02:59:53] that giant alive that's inside of me and by doing that we're able to turn things around and add a

[03:00:00] little bit of light and salt to the earth you guys be safe out there you guys be sane take care of

[03:00:07] yourself don't sell yourself short it's time to start talking ourselves up instead of putting

[03:00:13] ourselves down we've been doing it long enough and if you're not happy with where you're at right now

[03:00:18] then maybe it's time to start doing some changes we're gonna catch up and do this again real soon

[03:00:23] before i wrap it up i'd like to remind you all that if you would like to be a part of the show

[03:00:30] and share your story or even a story of someone in your life that has impacted you in a positive way

[03:00:37] you can always reach out to us via email i'd be happy to connect until next time and very soon peace

[03:00:58] i'm looking for a sign to know i'm on the right road

[03:01:05] you

[03:01:07] you

[03:01:07] you