Art, Poetry, And Exploring Human Nature || Gwendolyn Jazmin and Alisha Rose

[00:00:04] Welcome back to the show. This is now episode 4-0, the big 40. And a happy new year to everybody. It is now 2025. And this is Giants Amongst Us, where we share in the unique human experience and where you're going to hear real stories that are told by real people.

[00:00:55] People just like yourself. I hope this finds you in good spirits. I hope you guys are doing well. And if not, well, maybe, just maybe after listening to this episode, a little bit of light, a little bit of sunlight might shine upon you and help you out with whatever it is you're going through.

[00:01:17] And if this is your first time coming across the podcast, kick your feet up. Please do stay a while. If you like what you hear after this episode, after you're done listening to this, you can go back to the archives and listen to past stories and past guests talk about their own way that they were able to transcend struggles, challenges, setbacks, and create something better for themselves.

[00:01:42] There's a giant within all of us. The human spirit is truly resilient. And the hope is that these stories, these examples, all of these testimonies will wake you up to the fact that you're capable of great things.

[00:01:58] You're no different because your life has meaning. It has value. And it's up to us as an individual to wake up to that fact, to wake up and realize that we are the creators and the architects of our experience and of our story.

[00:02:14] It sure is good to be back to have another sit down to share with you all.

[00:02:19] And before we get into today's episode, I want to invite you, if you haven't already to go check out the website where you can get updates on the show.

[00:02:29] You can find out what's going on with the show. You can get early access to some of the conversations that are already had.

[00:02:35] There's blogs put up and there's also a way where you can get in contact with us, share your thoughts, anything you have on your mind.

[00:02:44] If you want to add to the conversation, if you want to let us know where you're listening from, how you're listening to the show, you can do that through email.

[00:02:52] You can leave a comment. You can even leave a voice message. It's always great to hear back from you all.

[00:02:58] And another thing is the YouTube channel. That's something that I like to do more with to have sit downs in front of the camera, shooting the breeze with you all staying connected in that way,

[00:03:09] having some walking talks and showing you a little bit of what's going on on my side of town.

[00:03:15] And I thought that would be a good way to stay connected and for you to add to the conversation if you like, so you can find us on YouTube.

[00:03:22] And with all of that out of the way, let's get into today's episode, shall we?

[00:03:28] This is going to be the first time for giants amongst us.

[00:03:31] The first time that we had the opportunity and the privilege for a three-way conversation.

[00:03:37] So it's only right doing something new that we bring in the new year with that.

[00:03:43] Two creative spirits, Gwendolyn Jasmine, a poet, and Alicia Rose, the painter and illustrator.

[00:03:51] Both of them, they collaborated.

[00:03:52] They've been friends for quite some time.

[00:03:55] They have a wonderful bond and they collaborated and created something that was beautiful, something that was meaningful and something that was exploring human nature in all of its shapes and forms.

[00:04:08] The book is now available.

[00:04:10] It's called The Canvas of Life and it's a collection of poetry and art.

[00:04:14] They both took time out of their busy schedule to join us and they have a story to tell.

[00:04:21] I thought I need to do something that's therapeutic.

[00:04:24] I need to do something that really helps my wellness.

[00:04:29] And so I started to write poetry and I had asked Alicia to come on board and to just paint, just out of curiosity.

[00:04:39] I just found for this, I want to portray emotion.

[00:04:42] And I always found that for me, I loved acrylic the most because I felt the most connected to it.

[00:04:49] And I had the best time with color with it.

[00:04:52] So ladies and gentlemen, without further ado, this is Gwendolyn Jasmine and Alicia Rose with their story.

[00:05:02] Ladies and gentlemen, welcome back to the show.

[00:05:06] This is Giants Amongst Us, where we share in the unique human experience.

[00:05:11] And I'm pleased to have another sit down and to be able to share another conversation.

[00:05:17] This is the first time that I'm having a three-way conversation.

[00:05:21] So there's a first time for everything.

[00:05:23] I'd like to introduce two guests.

[00:05:25] We had a nice breaking the ice conversation beforehand.

[00:05:28] And it's about time that we go ahead and allow these two young women to share a bit of their heart and some of the projects that they have been involved with.

[00:05:39] So I'd like to introduce Gwen and Alicia to the show.

[00:05:42] Thank you so much for taking time out of your day.

[00:05:45] You could have been anywhere.

[00:05:47] You could have been doing anything.

[00:05:48] But we're here having a sit down.

[00:05:51] So thank you.

[00:05:52] How is it going?

[00:05:53] Well, thank you, Richard.

[00:05:54] Thank you for having us.

[00:05:55] We're so excited to be here to talk about our book.

[00:05:59] It's a collaborative effort between the two of us.

[00:06:03] We're really good friends.

[00:06:04] And we've created a book of poetry and art.

[00:06:09] It's called The Canvas of Life, a collection of poetry and art.

[00:06:12] It was published this year.

[00:06:15] So we're just excited to get out there and talk to people about it, talk about the journey of us creating this together.

[00:06:23] I'm the author, the poet behind the book.

[00:06:25] And Alicia is the artist, the illustrator.

[00:06:29] And we started this project back in 2020 when we were all in a bit of a lockdown situation.

[00:06:38] Our worlds were quite different.

[00:06:40] I was behind a screen.

[00:06:42] I found myself behind a screen for the first time teaching.

[00:06:45] I've been teaching for over 10 years, and I'd always been a face-to-face instructor.

[00:06:51] And all of a sudden, I found myself teaching online, being very stressed and frustrated with technology and just frustrated with the way things were.

[00:07:02] It was really hard for teachers and students at the time.

[00:07:05] And I thought, I need to do something that's therapeutic.

[00:07:09] I need to do something that really helps my wellness.

[00:07:12] And so I started to write poetry.

[00:07:15] And I had asked Alicia to come on board and to just paint, just out of curiosity for fun.

[00:07:22] I thought it would be quite interesting to see if we could tell a story with a painting and a poem and see if we could harmoniously put that together.

[00:07:30] And she was excited because she's super creative.

[00:07:34] She's a talented artist.

[00:07:35] She's self-taught, but incredibly talented.

[00:07:39] And I asked her if she would be willing to collaborate.

[00:07:42] And it just went from there.

[00:07:44] It was a lot of fun.

[00:07:45] That's pretty cool.

[00:07:46] Okay, I'm sorry.

[00:07:47] So it is Alicia, not Alicia.

[00:07:50] I'm sorry for the mispronunciation.

[00:07:53] Oh, no, it's okay.

[00:07:54] I don't correct people anymore, actually.

[00:07:56] And so it's funny.

[00:07:57] We were on a podcast, and we just giggle all the time because we corrected the lady a few times.

[00:08:04] And she just couldn't get it right.

[00:08:06] It's just, it's funny.

[00:08:08] You know, it's funny.

[00:08:09] I always thought people would get my name incorrectly, but she could say Gwendolyn, no problem.

[00:08:15] Potato, potato, tomato, tomato.

[00:08:19] Yeah, it is Alicia.

[00:08:21] Okay, yeah, I'm sorry for the mispronunciation.

[00:08:23] But I got it.

[00:08:24] Alicia.

[00:08:25] Alicia.

[00:08:26] So we had a few back and forth through email, via email.

[00:08:30] And that's when I first was introduced to the...

[00:08:34] Project, the book that you two were working and painting, drawing, expressing yourself through art.

[00:08:42] Was that something that's always been a part of you?

[00:08:45] That's been in your blood in a way that you've been able to express yourself?

[00:08:49] Or just recently the same, just within the last few years, dibbling and dabbling with it?

[00:08:54] I've always done it since I was a little kid.

[00:08:56] I always loved to draw and paint when I was younger.

[00:08:58] And as I started getting older, I also started doing other forms of just creativity.

[00:09:04] I like to do house projects, any kind of DIY furniture building.

[00:09:09] It's just really fun for me to tackle something new and create something from nothing.

[00:09:15] And yeah, I've always been a big fan of any form of creativity, really.

[00:09:19] But I've always really gone back to painting.

[00:09:22] I've tried every kind of painting.

[00:09:24] I have watercolor, oil, everything.

[00:09:26] But I just found for this, I want to portray emotion.

[00:09:30] And I always found that for me, I loved acrylic the most because I felt the most connected to it.

[00:09:37] And I had the best time with color with it.

[00:09:41] So I thought it was perfect for the emotion in this book.

[00:09:45] Yeah, like Alicia is like an incredible...

[00:09:48] I think she's being a bit humble.

[00:09:49] She can build anything.

[00:09:50] She can renovate your kitchen.

[00:09:53] She can put up tiling, woodwork, flooring, framing.

[00:09:59] Is that right?

[00:10:00] She could be on one of those construction shows, create her own if she wanted to.

[00:10:05] Yes, I've done it all.

[00:10:06] Plumbing, electrical, siding, everything.

[00:10:09] It's all self-taught.

[00:10:11] Where did you pick all that up at?

[00:10:13] Just watching?

[00:10:14] You were around people that knew how to do it?

[00:10:16] Or you just...

[00:10:16] It was like just trial and error.

[00:10:18] I'm doing it myself and learning as I go.

[00:10:21] With the smaller things, it was trial and error.

[00:10:23] When it came to electrical and plumbing, I was like best to have a professional show me first before I decide to dabble with electricity.

[00:10:35] But yeah, for the most part, I just kind of watch, learn and get ideas and just kind of build off onto my own thing.

[00:10:43] Like I learned how to build basic stairs a long time ago.

[00:10:47] And then recently, I decided I'm going to try a little something different and made this grand staircase that just expands out and has a wine rack attached to the whole side of the wall and the staircase.

[00:10:59] And just add on to the creativity of basic stairs, you know, to something different.

[00:11:05] It's been really fun.

[00:11:07] Yeah.

[00:11:08] Yeah, that's awesome.

[00:11:10] My goodness.

[00:11:11] So now you understand why I wanted her on board.

[00:11:13] Exactly.

[00:11:14] Yeah.

[00:11:14] Iron sharpens iron.

[00:11:16] That's a good team right there.

[00:11:18] The dynamic duo.

[00:11:20] Yeah.

[00:11:20] Yeah.

[00:11:21] And really, we wanted to do something different.

[00:11:25] We wanted to bring poetry together with art and make it more understandable for people.

[00:11:31] Tell a story that evokes emotion through the words and the visuals.

[00:11:36] We thought that would be a really great, harmonious way to do it.

[00:11:41] We hadn't seen it done previously.

[00:11:44] We did a little bit of research.

[00:11:45] We've seen some books of poetry with some doodles or some drawings, but not vivid paintings with the poem.

[00:11:55] So I thought, like, I'm a very, I'm a visual learner.

[00:11:59] I love painting as well.

[00:12:02] In college, my favorite course was art history.

[00:12:06] Love paintings.

[00:12:07] And so I just thought, you know, the painting with the words can speak so much louder and tell a story so much deeper.

[00:12:16] And I thought, like, what a good way to kind of put something together.

[00:12:20] We really didn't see the vision at first.

[00:12:22] At first, it was truly, let's do this to be creative.

[00:12:26] Let's do this to have some fun.

[00:12:29] It was during COVID.

[00:12:30] So we were also very bored, stuck in our home.

[00:12:33] So it's like, it's an outlet for us to do something.

[00:12:36] Yeah.

[00:12:37] Something healthy, something exciting, creative that was therapeutic for both of us.

[00:12:43] And it was also a way for us to connect.

[00:12:45] We would call each other, collaborate over the phone because we do live in separate places.

[00:12:50] Alicia lives in a small town in the mountains and I live in the city.

[00:12:54] So it was a really great way to collaborate over the phone.

[00:12:57] And I'd send her a poem.

[00:12:59] I wouldn't really tell her my thoughts behind it.

[00:13:02] I just kind of send it to her, let her sit with it.

[00:13:05] And she would tell me the feelings and the thoughts that came from it.

[00:13:09] I'd tell her mine and we'd collaborate on the paintings.

[00:13:12] You know, it's great to hear that you both explored in that way.

[00:13:17] You know, when COVID was happening and everybody was shut down and in their homes, there were many people that they didn't make it out alive in the sense that they went to the drink.

[00:13:29] They went to the drugs.

[00:13:31] They did a lot of things that were destructive, but that you too were able to use that time and find ways that you can express yourself or you can just turn it inward and start to reflect on your imagination or just use your imagination and get creative.

[00:13:47] And this turned out to where you're able to tell a story, paint a story and use the best of both worlds to put it in a package and present it to the world.

[00:13:59] That's a beautiful thing.

[00:14:00] Thank you, Richard.

[00:14:02] We're very proud of it.

[00:14:03] We wouldn't have done it if we didn't have each other encouraging.

[00:14:06] Like if Alicia didn't push me and I didn't push Alicia, we wouldn't be here.

[00:14:10] So it's this wonderful relationship where you kind of do need someone sometimes to give you a little bit of a push, be your cheerleader, champion your talents.

[00:14:22] And we also had our friends and family rally behind us.

[00:14:27] Like they pushed us as well to do this and they were so proud of us.

[00:14:33] And I just want to say thank you to all of our friends and family who supported us.

[00:14:38] And really we're our biggest cheerleaders in this.

[00:14:42] At the beginning it was for us, but we now do it for everybody.

[00:14:47] We want everybody to share in this.

[00:14:49] Maybe there's some healing in it.

[00:14:52] Maybe there is empathy, a deeper understanding, reflection.

[00:14:56] Our goal is that it resonates with people in a positive way.

[00:15:00] Yeah.

[00:15:01] From the stories or the topics and subject matter, was that all having to do with personal experiences or did you gather experiences also from the people around you or just being an observer of life?

[00:15:16] How did you come about with the topics and the subjects and everything that's covered in the book and touched on?

[00:15:22] When I first started writing the poetry, it was personal.

[00:15:26] The poem that you like, Belief, is probably one of the first poems I wrote.

[00:15:30] Very personal poem.

[00:15:32] It was a reflection of my own spirituality.

[00:15:35] So quite a few of them are personal.

[00:15:37] But as we started collaborating, we were curious about other people's stories and we were curious to explore other themes.

[00:15:46] And so we wanted our book to include some of the hard stuff, themes about abuse, themes about death, but also the light and the beautiful gratitude.

[00:16:00] I have a poem about aging in the book.

[00:16:04] There's also a poem that I really, really love.

[00:16:08] It's called Rest.

[00:16:09] Rest.

[00:16:10] It's about, I wrote it for children, mothers speaking to their children.

[00:16:16] And also, Elisha, if you want to tell the one poem, the theme behind the one poem that's really close to you.

[00:16:22] Yeah, it's about kidney donation and organ donation.

[00:16:27] And that was actually something that my family went through together.

[00:16:31] And it was a really long process, hard process, but it was nice to have it because you get to see what it felt like for not just the recipient, but how the donor felt during this whole process.

[00:16:43] And so we did a poem on that, speaking to both sides, so that people who are either thinking about donating organs see how they're changing somebody's life, or somebody who's receiving can see how the other person who's giving it feels.

[00:17:00] They don't have to feel so horrible about taking an organ away from somebody.

[00:17:05] You know, this person gave their kidney willingly and wanted to have this person stay in their lives.

[00:17:11] So obviously, they'd do anything for them.

[00:17:13] It was a very impactful poem.

[00:17:17] And it really helped the family, I think, afterward.

[00:17:20] Getting to read that and see both sides of it together was really magical to see.

[00:17:25] Yeah, that's probably one of the happiest moments is when I wrote the poem and the recipient and the donor just told me how much they loved it and how much it really captured their experience and their feelings.

[00:17:40] But I wouldn't have been able to do it without their input, without having the opportunity to speak with them, talk to them, listen to them, listen to their perspectives, because they were quite different.

[00:17:52] The two perspectives were quite different.

[00:17:54] And we were able to put these paintings up in a hospital, in the ward of donation.

[00:18:02] And we've had people reach out to us and ask for prints of the painting because they think it's just so beautiful and it speaks to their family's current journey of going through a donation.

[00:18:16] And so I think we try to put our art out there, our book, and just put little seeds out there.

[00:18:24] And if it resonates with people, we're more than happy to meet with them, talk with them.

[00:18:30] I met the lady over coffee.

[00:18:33] I don't want this to be a transactional thing.

[00:18:36] I want it to be a connection.

[00:18:38] I want to be able to meet people, hear their stories, and really center myself and remember why we do this.

[00:18:46] We do this to be respectful, to shine light on these experiences, and also to help people, give a voice to people going through these different experiences.

[00:19:00] Because in our culture, we don't always talk through the healing.

[00:19:05] Some people bottle it in.

[00:19:07] And we just want this to be a little bit of a vessel that creates an opportunity to open up.

[00:19:14] Wow.

[00:19:14] This is something more than just words on a page and a drawing on a canvas or a page.

[00:19:23] These are meaningful connections that are happening because of it.

[00:19:26] And I think it's also having to do with the fact that they see the heart and the spirit and the soul behind the project itself.

[00:19:35] And it's like we were speaking about earlier.

[00:19:38] That can be contagious because people are missing that.

[00:19:42] Nowadays, especially with the movement, more and more online, those authentic, deep connections are missing.

[00:19:51] And when someone does feel it, it's very impactful.

[00:19:55] And it's enough to move somebody in a real way to where it resonates with them and they want more of it.

[00:20:03] And I think that's missing.

[00:20:04] And it shows with the way some of the people are reacting to it from the drawing, from the piece of art that they've seen,

[00:20:10] and also to the words that you write and the way that you express yourself through it.

[00:20:14] So, yeah, that's great to hear.

[00:20:16] That's great.

[00:20:16] I'm curious.

[00:20:17] This is audio, and so we can only just go off of words and we can't see a picture or illustration.

[00:20:23] But as far as that organ donor piece, what was the illustration about?

[00:20:29] If you can just give me a paint a picture, I guess you could say in words.

[00:20:34] Paint a picture with words.

[00:20:36] Describe the painting.

[00:20:38] That's actually one of my more simplistic ones.

[00:20:41] Again, I'm very much, I like the color, but I thought the absence of color is just as impactful.

[00:20:49] So when it comes to the very deeper tones, having the absence of color was important.

[00:20:54] So I did a silhouette.

[00:20:56] I have two paintings because one of it is about organ donations where the person passes on and donates all of their organs.

[00:21:04] And one of them is about the kidney donation because I wanted to do that for my family.

[00:21:10] And it's actually of my dad and my uncle.

[00:21:14] And they're standing side by side in their gowns.

[00:21:17] And it's a silhouette of them.

[00:21:20] And their kidneys are touching and glowing.

[00:21:24] It's almost glowing in the shape of a butterfly.

[00:21:27] Because for us, when life moves on, our family always talks about butterflies being the people just sending little carriers to come down in and check on you.

[00:21:36] That's how our family always spoke of it.

[00:21:38] And my grandparents passed away shortly or right before this all happened.

[00:21:44] So I wanted the butterfly to be in there as well to represent that she's there with them.

[00:21:50] And it's in the kidneys.

[00:21:52] Wow.

[00:21:54] And then the other one was the whole person was glowing.

[00:21:57] Everyone's standing there surrounding this person who's walking toward them away from us.

[00:22:02] And that person is glowing.

[00:22:04] And everyone that's standing around watching this person, each part of their organ that he donated is glowing inside of them.

[00:22:14] So it's him moving on into the next life, believing his mark and his impact on everybody else.

[00:22:21] That's a beautiful portrait.

[00:22:22] You were able to paint it with words in a way.

[00:22:26] And I've seen what you meant.

[00:22:27] And, you know, it's funny that you mentioned the butterflies because I remember hearing a story about some man and he was talking about his connection and his love for his mother.

[00:22:37] And then he said that when she passed away, that was like the only one in his life that really believed in him that he felt was a positive influence in his life.

[00:22:45] And someone that he really looked up to because he was raised by his mother.

[00:22:49] He didn't know his father.

[00:22:50] And when she passed away, he said for, if I could remember correctly, it was about a week or two weeks after that.

[00:22:58] He said that there was a butterfly that just would not leave him alone, following him everywhere he went.

[00:23:05] And he's like, that was my mother.

[00:23:07] We had the same kind of experience with our grandmother.

[00:23:11] Our niece was in the NICU and she was actually under the lights there.

[00:23:19] Under the lights where they have like jaundice?

[00:23:21] Yes.

[00:23:22] Oh, okay.

[00:23:23] Yeah, like the UV rays.

[00:23:24] And a butterfly managed to get into the NICU and fly.

[00:23:28] And we have a picture of it sitting on right over the baby.

[00:23:32] Just sitting on the light right over the baby.

[00:23:34] And it was like the likelihood of that happening is so weird.

[00:23:38] But, and the fact that it was a butterfly and it was just.

[00:23:42] In the hospital.

[00:23:43] In the hospital of all things, like to get all the way through there, right?

[00:23:46] We're not even on the first floor, but it's impressive.

[00:23:50] So it was like, maybe, maybe there's something to it.

[00:23:53] She is watching over us.

[00:23:54] And yeah.

[00:23:55] That is beautiful.

[00:23:57] And there's like, I've heard a lot of people say that when a life passes over, new life comes.

[00:24:04] Mm-hmm.

[00:24:05] Right.

[00:24:05] And that recently happened with a really good friend of mine.

[00:24:08] Her mom passed.

[00:24:10] And a few days later, yeah, she had her baby.

[00:24:15] So.

[00:24:16] Yeah.

[00:24:16] Those, those stories are beautiful.

[00:24:18] There's, you know, there's one individual I do remember.

[00:24:21] And he was talking about the bone marrow transplant.

[00:24:24] And the fact that he wished that he was able to get in contact with the donor.

[00:24:29] But I guess it's, it's within the donors.

[00:24:33] Right.

[00:24:34] Whether he wants to, or doesn't want to be contacted.

[00:24:37] I don't know if it's a disclosure.

[00:24:38] They're just trying to keep some kind of anonymity.

[00:24:40] But he really wished that he was able to just reach out and thank him.

[00:24:44] And, and I, that was reminded of that also, when you were talking about hearing both sides

[00:24:48] of the story, because sometimes the person who donates there, they're in the dark about

[00:24:54] what went on after the donation was happened.

[00:24:57] If it was a success, how the person is doing.

[00:24:59] And so it's, yeah, that, that's great to get both sides of it and to hear the whole story,

[00:25:05] the whole picture.

[00:25:05] So that's, that's cool that you were able to do that.

[00:25:08] And it's a, it sounds like it was impactful for the fact that people looked at the image

[00:25:13] and the drawing and the painting and they were moved and touched by that.

[00:25:18] Yes, it was, it was a very beautiful story that, and it's an experience that not everybody

[00:25:25] has, but it's a life-changing experience that some people do have and maybe it'll help them

[00:25:32] get through it and see the other side a little bit as well, or even convince somebody to donate,

[00:25:38] you know?

[00:25:39] Yeah.

[00:25:39] That would be amazing too, but yeah, it's nice to get that story out there and share it

[00:25:45] with the world.

[00:25:46] Yeah.

[00:25:47] How long was this process that the overall collaboration was it, did it seem like it went by pretty

[00:25:52] quick or it was a lot of, a lot of work behind the scenes to, to flesh this out and to, to

[00:25:58] create a final product?

[00:25:59] I think it would have been quicker if we started with the intention of creating a book because

[00:26:06] that's not how it started.

[00:26:08] And I'm grateful that it didn't start that way.

[00:26:10] Actually, I'm grateful that we were able to pursue this without any pressure and it was very

[00:26:17] organic and we had no idea that we would be publishing it because it allowed us to dig deep,

[00:26:25] be vulnerable and really have no limit.

[00:26:27] Yes.

[00:26:28] Cause you don't think anyone's going to see it.

[00:26:30] It's just something you're working on.

[00:26:31] So you're very vulnerable in it.

[00:26:33] And then now that you're showing people, I think you would have hit it a little bit like,

[00:26:37] okay, I can't tell people this.

[00:26:38] Yeah.

[00:26:38] But because we did it without knowing that we had the ability to be vulnerable.

[00:26:44] And I think that's more impactful for people to hear than just surface level.

[00:26:48] Yeah.

[00:26:48] So it took us from 2020 to 2024.

[00:26:50] We didn't plan on publishing it until probably March of 2023.

[00:26:56] Just the process of publishing took a while.

[00:26:59] We had to make all the paintings digital.

[00:27:02] Um, and then coming up with a name that was probably one of our biggest struggles is what

[00:27:09] are we going to call this book?

[00:27:10] Process of elimination.

[00:27:12] Yeah.

[00:27:13] The cover of the book was also a challenge for us.

[00:27:17] And then we just grounded ourselves and came back to what we know.

[00:27:21] And we wanted this book to feel like home, our hearts.

[00:27:27] And so we put the painting of the mountains and the lake, and it's a, it's a picture of

[00:27:34] the lake and the mountains where we both grew up.

[00:27:37] So it is a sense of home for us.

[00:27:40] Alicia still lives there.

[00:27:41] She's very fortunate to be surrounded by the Rocky mountains and the name she painted

[00:27:47] on canvas.

[00:27:48] Uh, it felt like a tapestry, a canvas of stories and it was stories about life.

[00:27:56] And so we went with the canvas of life, a collection of poetry and art just to make it understandable.

[00:28:02] We gave it that subtitle, but yeah, we swirled with that piece for longer than we should

[00:28:07] have.

[00:28:08] Um, cause Alicia and I both being very creative people were also very, um, a flighty in our

[00:28:16] thinking process.

[00:28:17] Scatterbrained a little bit.

[00:28:18] Yeah.

[00:28:19] Settle down on one thing, you know?

[00:28:21] Yeah.

[00:28:22] I guess that's what you get when you get two creative people together.

[00:28:24] There's a lot of energy.

[00:28:26] Yeah.

[00:28:27] Yeah.

[00:28:28] But it did take about four years, but again, it may have been quicker if we knew where we

[00:28:32] were going with it, but I wouldn't have changed it.

[00:28:35] It really helped me.

[00:28:37] I believe put out some of my best poetry without any limits.

[00:28:42] And Gwen, you said, did you, if I, if I, uh, remember correctly, you started writing poetry

[00:28:47] 2020 or you've always had a fascination and you've always had a love for poetry.

[00:28:54] Yeah.

[00:28:54] I started writing the poetry for the book in 2020.

[00:28:56] I've always dabbled in poetry though.

[00:28:59] I have a very distinct memory of being in grade eight and I wrote a poem called shattered.

[00:29:06] And it was about the experience of migrants from Kosovo.

[00:29:10] And I wrote the poem and I remember my teacher telling me, this is really well written.

[00:29:19] And there's so much heart into this.

[00:29:20] And I remember also a girl who was like the biggest bully of the school.

[00:29:26] She came up to me and she's like, I love this.

[00:29:28] And I thought like, I was a very unpopular kid and this kid, she really loved it.

[00:29:34] And I just thought to myself, huh?

[00:29:36] Like, that's really neat that it resonates with people.

[00:29:38] And so I just kept writing after that.

[00:29:41] And I'd write in my journal and some of the poems are, you know, quite immature, right?

[00:29:48] You're just like 14, 15 years of age, right?

[00:29:51] Some of them about all the crushes that we had back in the day with all the boy bands and stuff.

[00:30:00] But I definitely found a sense of peace.

[00:30:04] Well, you actually put shattered into the book.

[00:30:07] I did.

[00:30:07] Oh, did you?

[00:30:08] Okay, revised.

[00:30:09] I rewrote it.

[00:30:11] Yeah, I called the poem Mosaic.

[00:30:14] It's a tribute to migrant women that come to Canada and their stories and their experiences and how they do feel broken and shattered.

[00:30:28] But they're a mosaic and all of their pieces matter.

[00:30:33] And I wanted to write this poem because I'm an educator.

[00:30:37] I'm an adult educator of many immigrants and refugees to Canada.

[00:30:41] And I have had the privilege and it's a joy to get to meet these women that have these incredible stories of resiliency and hardship and of courage.

[00:30:55] And it just, when you hear the stories, your mind is blown.

[00:30:59] You just cannot believe how resilient the human spirit can be.

[00:31:04] And so I wrote this poem Mosaic for those women.

[00:31:07] It really is the best of both worlds when you're talking about poetry, the written word, the power of word, and then symbols and images.

[00:31:18] From images and symbols, I mean, you see one symbol and automatically, what do they say?

[00:31:23] A picture is worth a thousand words.

[00:31:24] And just the way that we're influenced by these symbols and these images from advertisements.

[00:31:31] You have a Nike or Adidas or whatever it is.

[00:31:34] And just seeing it and some people are driven to want to pursue whatever they need to pursue so they can make the money that they need to make in order that they could purchase this thing because of this symbol and this image and what it brings to them or means to them.

[00:31:49] And on the other hand, to be able to use it in another sense to where it's moving, it's bringing some type of reflection into your life or making you turn inward and think about something that's meaningful to you or an experience that you had.

[00:32:04] And also with the power of word, how it can impact someone, how it could build somebody up, but at the same time, how it's able to tear somebody down.

[00:32:12] And they say, sticks and stones may break my bones, but words that never hurt me.

[00:32:17] But words do have life.

[00:32:18] They have a creative life and they also have a destructive life.

[00:32:21] So to hear you talk about these stories and the experiences that you've experienced in your life and also some of the things that you're sharing with this book is a testament to exactly the way and the heart that you have behind this to where you're pushing something positive,

[00:32:40] something meaningful, something genuine, something genuine, and it all formed organically.

[00:32:44] So that's just a wonderful thing.

[00:32:46] It's really encouraging to hear.

[00:32:48] Oh, thank you, Richard.

[00:32:49] And I think it would be appropriate for me to read the poem, Mosaic.

[00:32:52] Yes, please do.

[00:32:54] Yeah, I'll read the poem and then I'll have Alicia describe the painting because the painting is absolutely beautiful.

[00:33:02] Okay, Mosaic.

[00:33:14] I'm a warrior.

[00:33:29] I'm a survivor.

[00:33:30] Liquid gold that splatters.

[00:33:33] Into a million pieces.

[00:33:34] A mosaic that matters.

[00:33:37] That's beautiful.

[00:33:38] I love that.

[00:33:40] Yeah.

[00:33:41] Thank you.

[00:33:42] And Alicia, she painted.

[00:33:45] It's a portrait of a woman.

[00:33:49] And do you want to describe it, Alicia?

[00:33:52] Yeah, I can try.

[00:33:56] It's hard to describe my thought process for this because I am very scatterbrained and my thought process is all over the place when I'm painting.

[00:34:04] But for this one, I thought there's a Japanese tradition where if something breaks, you use gold to repair it.

[00:34:17] And you can see the gold cracks throughout it.

[00:34:20] And it actually builds it stronger.

[00:34:21] So when porcelain falls and breaks, it's stronger when it's repaired with gold.

[00:34:26] And it's also now worth more money as well.

[00:34:29] It's richer.

[00:34:30] And so I put this woman and she has cracks through her skin, but they're golden.

[00:34:36] So it was something that was trying to break her.

[00:34:39] But the light inside her is so pure, so golden, so strong.

[00:34:43] So she was held together through that.

[00:34:46] And that light is shining through that gold, is coming through those cracks, showing that she's worth more.

[00:34:55] She's stronger than she thought.

[00:34:58] Wow, that's a hell of a concept.

[00:35:00] Yeah.

[00:35:01] Did you do some research on the whole jet, you know, to have that idea, to use it in your painting?

[00:35:10] Or this is just something that was in the back of your mind because you already knew about it and said,

[00:35:15] OK, I can incorporate this into what I want to do and what I'd like to do.

[00:35:19] And you start getting to work.

[00:35:22] I did a little bit of research on the gold, using gold for porcelain or repairing things,

[00:35:31] because I wanted to make sure that I showed exactly what it was about.

[00:35:37] So why they do it is because it's stronger.

[00:35:40] It gives it more worth.

[00:35:43] It gives it more beauty.

[00:35:44] And I wanted that to really reflect in this painting.

[00:35:47] I really loved the idea of it.

[00:35:49] And so I wanted to incorporate it into the painting.

[00:35:52] And I thought the perfect, we talk about the soul a lot.

[00:35:56] And I thought that was perfect, that her soul was what was strong enough to repair her and show her inner beauty.

[00:36:04] And yeah, so even though she's cracked and felt broken on the outside, her soul is strong enough to repair it.

[00:36:09] And it's beautiful.

[00:36:11] Wow, that's a great concept.

[00:36:13] There's so much creativity behind all of it, from couching the words to portray and convey a certain feeling and emotion and experience and walking.

[00:36:25] And also the drawings and the paintings and the meaning behind it.

[00:36:29] This is because I, for one, I can't draw for anything.

[00:36:31] I mean, I could probably just do stick figures.

[00:36:33] I always would idolize people that were able to draw.

[00:36:38] My brother, he was real good at drawing.

[00:36:40] And it's just something that I know some people believe like, oh, this is just a talent that you're born with.

[00:36:45] But there's a lot of work that you have to go.

[00:36:49] There's some people, yes, that are born with certain gifts.

[00:36:52] But it takes time and it takes effort and it takes energy to start to craft that.

[00:36:58] And it sounds like throughout the years you've been doing a lot of that, both of you, from writing and expressing yourself through poetry.

[00:37:05] And then also, Alicia, through your arts and creating these masterpieces.

[00:37:12] Can we go ahead and call it that?

[00:37:13] These masterpieces.

[00:37:15] They are.

[00:37:17] They are.

[00:37:19] I really liked the challenge that it gave me doing this book.

[00:37:23] Because usually my drawings and paintings, they were always very nature themed.

[00:37:28] It was things that I took beauty from or things that I saw inspiration in.

[00:37:35] And I lived in the mountains.

[00:37:36] So I always took a lot from the mountains, the animals that live there.

[00:37:40] This gave me the ability to see other things and different perspectives.

[00:37:45] And be able to draw just crazy things I wouldn't have drawn before.

[00:37:50] So it was a lot of fun and it was challenging to do.

[00:37:54] It's like you had to step out of your comfort zone for that one a little bit, didn't you?

[00:37:57] Yes, I did.

[00:37:59] And then I had to step even further and actually show people publicly.

[00:38:02] So that one was a big one for me.

[00:38:05] Yeah, you know, that raises a good question.

[00:38:07] Have you ever, before this, would you ever show it to anybody besides just maybe, I don't even know if you showed it to your family or friends.

[00:38:17] It was just something that you did for you and that was it.

[00:38:19] Did you hold it real tight?

[00:38:21] Hold your cards close to your chest?

[00:38:22] So my very close family knew of it because, I mean, I would spend hours and days just, you know, coloring or drawing and painting.

[00:38:32] So they knew about it.

[00:38:34] I kept it very private, though I had my own private room that I kept it locked in this closet.

[00:38:38] Nobody could come and see my stuff.

[00:38:40] And then I started brought it to like, I consider Gwen and her family, I consider them family.

[00:38:47] And when they moved away, it was very, it was a very sad day that they moved.

[00:38:53] I understood why.

[00:38:54] It's a small town and they moved to the city for the amenities and to be closer to their family.

[00:38:59] But when they moved, they were leaving the mountains.

[00:39:01] So I wanted to give them something to leave with.

[00:39:04] And then that's kind of when I showed them that I'm actually doing this art as well.

[00:39:10] So.

[00:39:11] Yeah.

[00:39:12] Yeah.

[00:39:13] Yeah.

[00:39:13] And I just remember my mom's reaction, like my mom's Mexican and she's so exuberant.

[00:39:19] And she's like, Alicia, this is so beautiful.

[00:39:23] And yeah, so like everybody around her was just, you know, encouraging her to keep doing it because it's so beautiful.

[00:39:32] And she's so humble about it.

[00:39:35] There's this humility behind her work.

[00:39:37] And I really appreciate that because in our collaboration process, we were open to each other's ideas.

[00:39:45] We are.

[00:39:47] We hold space for each other's thoughts.

[00:39:50] And we don't.

[00:39:52] We always approach in a very positive way.

[00:39:55] If we're ever having conflict, it's usually just internal conflict.

[00:39:59] Yeah.

[00:40:00] And then the other person talks you down out of it.

[00:40:02] Yeah.

[00:40:02] So when Alicia's swirling in her painting process and not really sure of what to do, I try to encourage her.

[00:40:09] And when I was getting the writer's block or the uncertainty of am I giving this experience justice, she would always encourage me.

[00:40:20] So truly grateful to have a partner in creation because it's so makes it so much easier.

[00:40:29] And showing people easier as well.

[00:40:30] When you have somebody there with you, it's not as nerve wracking going out by yourself and going, hey, look what I did.

[00:40:36] Especially like I live in a small town, so everybody knows everybody.

[00:40:39] So when they all found out, it was quite intimidating because they all know me and none of them knew that about me.

[00:40:46] So they knew I like to be creative, but.

[00:40:49] Oh, wow.

[00:40:50] Okay.

[00:40:50] So this is very personal for you then.

[00:40:52] Yes.

[00:40:52] It is.

[00:40:52] So it's also being, well, that's really what it is too, right?

[00:40:57] When you're sharing, whether it's writing, whether it's drawing, making music, whatever it is, something that is very personal to you, that's being vulnerable when you're sharing a piece of your heart.

[00:41:12] Even coming on a podcast and talking about some of your journey and the creative processes and some of the things that worked and didn't work.

[00:41:18] Whether or not we're strangers and in the distance, I mean, to share that with people, that opens yourself up and leaves a lot of vulnerability out there.

[00:41:29] And that takes courage and guts.

[00:41:31] And I guess, like you said, you both had each other to kind of warm up to the idea and make it a bit easier in the long run.

[00:41:39] But the fact that you were able to do it is, that's commanding in itself.

[00:41:43] Thank you.

[00:41:44] Yeah, it was quite the journey.

[00:41:46] And it is still quite the journey that we're going through right now.

[00:41:50] It's turned into a really good journey.

[00:41:52] We got so many great stories from people and we're still speaking with people, getting more stories.

[00:41:58] The amount of people that reached out to us afterward was really cool.

[00:42:03] And sharing their stories and or how a story resonated with them.

[00:42:07] It was cool to get that.

[00:42:09] And people saying, oh, we should do another book.

[00:42:12] And so we are starting to write stories now for another one because there is no shortage of human experience.

[00:42:18] Absolutely.

[00:42:19] I think there is some more stories that deserve to be told.

[00:42:22] Gwen brought up the writer's block.

[00:42:24] I wonder how you two, maybe in your own way, how do you deal with that when you do feel like you hit a wall?

[00:42:30] I've heard stories about how some people, they say, well, you pull away from it.

[00:42:36] Whether you're looking at a blank page and you just can't figure it out.

[00:42:40] Nothing comes out.

[00:42:42] You just involve yourself in doing something else.

[00:42:44] Just go for a walk.

[00:42:45] Get out in nature.

[00:42:47] Occupy your time doing something else.

[00:42:49] Something constructive.

[00:42:50] And that will in turn open up the gates and you're able to maybe get past that.

[00:42:55] I know some writers and thinkers, they say that they just go for walks.

[00:42:59] And then those morning walks or afternoon walks or evening walks, that's when they start to get ideas.

[00:43:04] And then from there, they run with it.

[00:43:07] I don't know how it works for you two.

[00:43:08] Or if you could talk a bit about how you push past or just deal with the when the creativity is at a standstill.

[00:43:15] Do you force it or do you go about it in a certain way?

[00:43:20] Yeah, I find that if I force it, it gets worse.

[00:43:24] I find that when I try to force it, I get frustrated.

[00:43:27] And then the poetry and the lines that I'm writing, I become more unhappier with what I'm creating.

[00:43:34] So I put it away.

[00:43:36] I put it aside.

[00:43:37] I let it go.

[00:43:39] And sometimes I've let it go for like a couple weeks.

[00:43:42] Just let it go.

[00:43:43] Come back to it with a fresh eyes, fresh perspective.

[00:43:48] And I 100% agree that those ideas, those tidbits, those little moments of glimmer ideas come to you when you least expect them.

[00:43:58] Like when you're washing dishes, you're like, oh, you know, that's how I should write that.

[00:44:05] Or, you know, I should actually land on this instead of that.

[00:44:07] So you're right in the distraction of just doing something where you're not forcing your brain to be overly productive.

[00:44:18] It's like those ideas creep in.

[00:44:21] On the walk, washing the dishes, you know.

[00:44:24] Or when you're talking to someone.

[00:44:25] I like to bounce ideas off people.

[00:44:27] Like I'll talk to Gwen and go, I'm just stuck.

[00:44:30] I don't know what to say.

[00:44:31] Don't know how I'm going to paint this.

[00:44:33] And we'll bounce ideas back and forth between each other.

[00:44:37] And then it'll just be like one word or one little, just something to trigger your mind.

[00:44:43] And you're like, oh, wait, I can work with that.

[00:44:46] And then it can be very random too.

[00:44:49] Yeah.

[00:44:50] Asking for help.

[00:44:51] I've asked Alicia for help.

[00:44:53] And she's asked me for help.

[00:44:55] And we just bounce ideas back and forth and really just have a bit of a brainstorm together.

[00:45:03] And those are my favorite moments when we actually sit and start to brainstorm and be creative together.

[00:45:09] But once it starts to become forced and painful, we step away from it.

[00:45:17] Because, and we didn't do this in a linear process.

[00:45:22] I'd be working on a poem, maybe not quite finished.

[00:45:25] Alicia would be painting.

[00:45:26] I'd be starting something new.

[00:45:28] She'd be painting that.

[00:45:29] We were circling back and forth a lot.

[00:45:33] It wasn't linear.

[00:45:34] We were, if she was tired painting this one, she would go and, you know, work on another one.

[00:45:40] And if I was tired with a poem, I'd put that one aside.

[00:45:44] Or repaint the whole painting.

[00:45:45] Or she would repaint the whole painting.

[00:45:47] Oh, wow.

[00:45:47] So, and I really love that because there's a method to the magic.

[00:45:53] Sounds like it.

[00:45:54] Some people would say math, but I'm going to tell you.

[00:45:58] I like that.

[00:45:59] You put a different twist on it.

[00:46:01] I can agree.

[00:46:04] Yeah.

[00:46:05] But yeah, you can't force things.

[00:46:07] Anything in life that is forced always has pushback.

[00:46:11] I 100% agree.

[00:46:13] I hear, I ask that because I also hear there's some people like maybe that just comes, comes

[00:46:18] down to the simple fact of just practicing.

[00:46:20] Now, maybe not forcing, but there are some people that put themselves on a routine or

[00:46:26] a schedule.

[00:46:27] So, like they, I have to write a certain amount of lines every day, no matter, no matter whether

[00:46:33] it's good or not.

[00:46:34] But it's just the fact of me practicing and doing it.

[00:46:37] And the same with people drawing or the same with people singing like you, or whatever it

[00:46:42] is that they're doing.

[00:46:43] And they have a craft that they love and they involve themselves with hobbies, building something

[00:46:49] that they, they like to put their practice in and put the hours in.

[00:46:52] And you hear some people say a 5,000 hours and you become a master at whatever it is.

[00:46:57] But there, I think there is some truth to the fact that if you're putting more time and energy

[00:47:03] into something, of course, you're going to get better at it.

[00:47:06] But again, that, that fine line with pushing and forcing something, it comes off.

[00:47:11] People can see that in, in you, you can feel it yourself.

[00:47:14] And I think overall, it's probably something that you wouldn't be proud of or satisfied

[00:47:18] with if you, if you did it that way.

[00:47:21] Yeah, I agree.

[00:47:22] I agree.

[00:47:22] We definitely put a heart and a lot of effort and hard work into this, but we always wanted

[00:47:30] to keep our integrity with it.

[00:47:32] Yeah.

[00:47:32] And keep true to the stories that were, we were being told not to change the story or, oh,

[00:47:38] well, this sounds better.

[00:47:39] You know, we wanted the story to be what the story was.

[00:47:43] So when people who are going through that situation go, yes, that's exactly it.

[00:47:49] You know, instead of missing the mark, we wanted to stay true to those stories.

[00:47:54] Yeah.

[00:47:54] I think that was what, that's what we focused on more was being authentic to the experience.

[00:48:02] And yeah, that was our biggest focus was always trying to be authentic to the experience and

[00:48:08] making sure that we were always respectful in having that integrity.

[00:48:13] Of, you know, making sure that we show up for people in the right way, because it may

[00:48:19] not be our experience, but this is something very real for somebody else.

[00:48:23] For example, the poems about abuse.

[00:48:27] And for me, it wasn't so much about the poetry.

[00:48:30] It was more about the storytelling.

[00:48:32] And I had to make sure that that was, that was right.

[00:48:35] Yeah.

[00:48:36] Because poetry is not for everybody, you know, not, it's not for everybody.

[00:48:40] Art's not for everybody.

[00:48:42] But what was for us was the story had to have truth.

[00:48:47] That was our united front and our goal.

[00:48:50] And I'm very fortunate that I have a friend who lives her life with integrity and I do as

[00:48:55] well.

[00:48:56] So we never strayed from that.

[00:48:59] And as we move forward, because we want to continue writing and painting and create another

[00:49:04] book, we're going to swirl in the title again.

[00:49:07] I'm sure.

[00:49:08] Yeah.

[00:49:08] That will always be the, the drive behind us is to make sure that we're telling authentically

[00:49:17] and with integrity.

[00:49:19] That's encouraging and refreshing to hear.

[00:49:22] Please do.

[00:49:23] I'm sure you will, but please do because the world needs more of that.

[00:49:28] God knows how many times that I come across and I'm not knocking anybody or what they do,

[00:49:33] but the fact that especially with everybody searching for some type of notoriety or to get

[00:49:43] a certain amount of likes or subscribers, I was joking about it.

[00:49:47] Yeah.

[00:49:47] There's going to be earlier.

[00:49:48] There's a million listeners, but you know, just the fact that people are willing to do

[00:49:53] things, do anything to say anything and to act in any way, just to get publicity and just

[00:49:59] to get hooks on their social media feed, or just to get more people to pay attention to

[00:50:08] what they're doing or to get more revenue in return, but not to be authentic to themselves

[00:50:13] or what's true to them.

[00:50:14] And so it's good to hear that there are still some people out there that are willing to stand

[00:50:21] by their morals, stand by their integrity and have, and have that direct them.

[00:50:28] And that's just very encouraging to hear.

[00:50:32] And yes, the world definitely needs more of that because that's also one of the reasons

[00:50:40] that I enjoy doing the podcast is because these are the type of people and the interactions

[00:50:45] that I love to connect with is because I share those same values.

[00:50:49] So when you find people that are in line with that, it's great.

[00:50:51] And I think that's an awesome feat to have.

[00:50:54] And yeah, just keep to your guns and keep doing that.

[00:50:57] That's a great thing to hear.

[00:50:58] Thank you so much, Richard, for your encouragement and for holding space for us and giving us

[00:51:04] the opportunity to really talk about what's near and dear to our heart.

[00:51:09] Have you had any?

[00:51:10] No, I was going to ask you, we talked about like the organic build towards this, that it

[00:51:15] wasn't at first thought of as we're going to do this book or anything, but all of the good

[00:51:19] that came from it and of it.

[00:51:22] And I'm curious along the way, did any of you had any doubts about the project or did

[00:51:30] you have a change of heart or any stumbling blocks or things in the way that almost detoured

[00:51:38] you from completing this?

[00:51:39] Um, no, cause we didn't know it was going to be a book at the beginning.

[00:51:43] And once we decided it was going to be a book, we were going to go through with it.

[00:51:48] These are stories that need to be told.

[00:51:50] We were very passionate right from the get-go of starting the book and we wanted this out

[00:51:57] no matter what it took us to do to get it out.

[00:52:01] We saw these stories, we were told these stories and we wanted to do it justice and make them

[00:52:07] real and bring it to the world.

[00:52:09] Almost like a sense of responsibility.

[00:52:12] Yes.

[00:52:13] You know, if people are willing to open up to us, we got to follow through.

[00:52:17] Yeah.

[00:52:17] Right.

[00:52:18] So yeah, we definitely felt that sense of responsibility and that sense of pride also

[00:52:25] to be able to follow through for the people that we love and who have shared these stories

[00:52:29] with us to honor them and to give their story a voice.

[00:52:33] Mm-hmm.

[00:52:34] The biggest hurdle I think for us was just going through the publishing process.

[00:52:39] There's a lot of tidbits in that process.

[00:52:43] But between Alicia and I, we're very collaborative.

[00:52:46] We have a lot of experience working on a team.

[00:52:48] So we were able to get through that together.

[00:52:51] And yeah, it was just kind of getting through just the logistical stuff, like the size of

[00:52:57] the book, the texture of the front cover, the title, the tell you me about the author

[00:53:03] piece on the back about the illustrator, right?

[00:53:06] Those are things that were hard for us because Alicia and I are very good at sharing experience.

[00:53:11] But when it brings it back to us, we freeze.

[00:53:14] Tell me about yourself.

[00:53:15] I'm like, I don't know.

[00:53:16] Myself is a person.

[00:53:17] I'm like, okay, let me tell you about myself.

[00:53:20] I think a lot of us are like that.

[00:53:22] Some of the hardest questions to answer.

[00:53:25] Somebody else tell me about me.

[00:53:28] Oh, sorry.

[00:53:29] I prep my students for that question for interviews all the time.

[00:53:32] We talk about that question at length for interviews.

[00:53:35] It has many different angles.

[00:53:37] You can answer it in many different ways.

[00:53:39] But I wrote in the tell me about yourself.

[00:53:42] I've been a teacher for many, many years.

[00:53:46] That's what I am.

[00:53:47] My purpose is living through the giving, a life of service.

[00:53:52] I always show up for my students.

[00:53:53] And as an educator, I felt that I needed to share my students' stories in this book.

[00:53:59] I needed to share my friends' experiences in this book, my experiences, because we're all worthy of our stories.

[00:54:08] And we're also greater than our experiences.

[00:54:11] If you've had some hard experiences, you are greater than those.

[00:54:15] And you can overcome them.

[00:54:18] And the healing for a lot of people is through connection.

[00:54:21] Connecting with people through storytelling.

[00:54:24] I'm a narrative teacher.

[00:54:26] I tend to tell a lot of stories in my classroom.

[00:54:28] My students tell their stories in my classroom.

[00:54:30] And my goal is always to build community, build a sense of community.

[00:54:36] And I hope this book, in these little circles, builds community.

[00:54:41] We are the author of our own story.

[00:54:43] And we can always rewrite our story.

[00:54:45] We don't have to continue to follow that same path.

[00:54:49] And sometimes there's people around us or people that we've come across throughout life.

[00:54:56] And they tell us who we are.

[00:54:58] And they tell us what we're good at, what we're not good at.

[00:55:00] And we can start believing that.

[00:55:02] And those are programs that we can rewrite, rewire, and turn over a new leaf.

[00:55:08] And start creating new experiences in a totally, completely new reality.

[00:55:13] By changing just the attitude and the beliefs that are going on within that real estate.

[00:55:19] The psychological real estate upstairs to just change that.

[00:55:23] And that start, in turn, changes your behavior, your habits, and lifestyle, and overall reality.

[00:55:31] So, yeah, we can rewrite our story and push the greener pastures, I guess, to be cliche about it.

[00:55:39] Yeah, absolutely.

[00:55:42] Absolutely.

[00:55:43] And one story isn't like the end of the chapter nor the end of the book.

[00:55:48] And heck, your life can be a series of books, right?

[00:55:52] How has the response been for everybody that have been involved in the book?

[00:55:58] Like, as far as some stories that you've told or personal experiences that you've shared from people around you?

[00:56:04] Have they read the poems and looked at the artwork?

[00:56:10] And if so, how has their reaction been towards it?

[00:56:14] Very positive.

[00:56:15] I mean, some of them cried seeing that because it was a very emotional thing for them.

[00:56:20] And to see it written out like that.

[00:56:23] And that's worth more than gold in itself, right?

[00:56:26] To get the reactions that are heartfelt.

[00:56:28] Yes.

[00:56:29] Yeah.

[00:56:29] It was a very emotional time showing them, actually.

[00:56:34] It was the whole night was just talking about it and being emotional together.

[00:56:39] And they've all been very supportive since.

[00:56:42] It's been really nice.

[00:56:43] And how long has it been available?

[00:56:45] Because now, like, if you can talk about where people can find it at and how many poems exactly and illustrations are in this book of yours?

[00:56:55] It's been available for just this year.

[00:56:59] We just published it this year toward the beginning.

[00:57:02] But it took us a while to get it figured out how to even send it to ourselves.

[00:57:08] But we did it toward the beginning of the year.

[00:57:12] And we have 22 poems and 16 paintings.

[00:57:17] Because some of the paintings have multiple poems with them to show two sides of the story.

[00:57:23] Okay, cool.

[00:57:24] But, yeah.

[00:57:26] And we have it available on Amazon in Canada.

[00:57:30] There's the Indigo website.

[00:57:32] Indigo bookstore websites.

[00:57:34] And Friesen Press is the publisher that we went through.

[00:57:37] And they have it available on their website as well.

[00:57:39] But probably Amazon for everyone else is the easiest.

[00:57:44] Unless you're from Canada, Indigo might be a better option.

[00:57:48] Yeah.

[00:57:49] Or Friesen Press.

[00:57:50] Or Friesen Press.

[00:57:52] Yeah.

[00:57:53] We sent you an email with the details, Richard.

[00:57:56] So if you could share.

[00:57:57] That would be wonderful.

[00:57:58] Yeah.

[00:57:59] Okay, cool.

[00:58:00] And check it out.

[00:58:00] And when you do look at it, please let us know some of the other poems.

[00:58:04] And which ones resonated with you.

[00:58:06] Because so far our feedback hasn't been consistent.

[00:58:10] Everyone's been, well, this poem spoke to me.

[00:58:12] And this painting.

[00:58:13] And this.

[00:58:14] And they've all been different from the other ones.

[00:58:16] So it's nice to see which ones speak to which people.

[00:58:19] We were emailing each other, myself and Alicia.

[00:58:23] And we were setting the conversation up and everything.

[00:58:26] And after I looked up the title of the book.

[00:58:30] And I was able to get a sample of it through Amazon.

[00:58:32] And Belief was the one that I came across.

[00:58:35] And I said, that is what I'm talking about.

[00:58:38] That's my heart.

[00:58:40] And it really resonated with me.

[00:58:42] And if I can, could I share that?

[00:58:45] Yes.

[00:58:46] So this one is by Gwen.

[00:58:48] And this is Belief.

[00:58:49] And this was available on the sample.

[00:58:52] So after I seen that.

[00:58:53] And I was able to read a, I believe it had two or three poems.

[00:58:57] But this was one that really, really struck a chord with me.

[00:59:02] So Belief.

[00:59:05] Existence is my God.

[00:59:08] Universe is my religion.

[00:59:10] Nature is my place of worship.

[00:59:13] Life is my miracle.

[00:59:14] Hearts are my scriptures.

[00:59:17] Stars are my ancestors.

[00:59:20] Memories are my hymns.

[00:59:22] Dreams are my prayers.

[00:59:24] Service is my tithings.

[00:59:27] Humanity is my purpose.

[00:59:29] Peace is my heaven.

[00:59:31] Love is my faith.

[00:59:34] That is beautiful.

[00:59:37] Thank you, Richard.

[00:59:38] When I read that, everything about it, it's just the whole,

[00:59:42] it's pretty much wrapping up the whole human experience and its entirety from nature, life,

[00:59:50] the heart and service of giving, of being of service.

[00:59:54] All of that wrapped up into, like you were saying, some people maybe that fall under a certain religious category.

[01:00:02] They may take offense to it, but I don't see how they can.

[01:00:06] This is really about the human experience and expressing oneself through life and living.

[01:00:13] And so I thought that was very well put.

[01:00:16] And every line is just, yes, amen, amen, amen.

[01:00:22] Amen.

[01:00:22] Yes.

[01:00:23] And every line was thoughtfully written and really true to my heart.

[01:00:28] That is a personal poem, Richard.

[01:00:31] I resonate and believe every line that I wrote, and that's why I called it Belief.

[01:00:37] And the book starts with that spirituality.

[01:00:40] It starts with belief.

[01:00:42] It goes into the next poem, which is called Her.

[01:00:45] It's about Mother Earth creation.

[01:00:49] And then it just continues with that exploration of spirituality.

[01:00:54] And then it kind of takes you on a ride, takes you on a little highs and lows because life is all about ebb and flow, right?

[01:01:02] And so it starts with that spirituality and then it ends with the ending of life.

[01:01:08] And it kind of brings you back from full circle.

[01:01:11] I wanted this book to have intention and have a flow.

[01:01:16] And I wanted it to be also a book with intention and simplicity.

[01:01:21] I know sometimes you can find a lot of poetry with a lot of tidbit, like small poems.

[01:01:27] And they're quite numerous.

[01:01:29] There's many, many poems.

[01:01:31] And I wanted this to have substance.

[01:01:33] But I wanted the substance to really be about quality and flow.

[01:01:38] So I wanted you to find your, I wanted it to be a journey.

[01:01:43] And a journey that you really find yourself understanding and connecting each poem to the next poem.

[01:01:50] And you're not getting lost because it's not just an isolated poem.

[01:01:54] They kind of built.

[01:01:55] And it was a tricky decision because we thought, should we make this book longer?

[01:02:00] And we thought, no, I think we're done.

[01:02:03] When we knew we were done, we knew we were done.

[01:02:05] And we knew that the next book would have a different flow to it.

[01:02:10] And we're going to really be thoughtful about how we do that one.

[01:02:14] Yeah.

[01:02:15] But it was...

[01:02:16] That was a lot of thought behind that.

[01:02:18] Yeah.

[01:02:19] I really think that sometimes less is more.

[01:02:22] Yeah.

[01:02:22] And so that's why we kept it to the 22 poems and the 16 paintings.

[01:02:27] And really try to make the book a good size so that you could really get a great visual of the paintings.

[01:02:35] And allow yourself.

[01:02:37] And even just having it like on your coffee table.

[01:02:39] I know a lot of people that have spoken to me.

[01:02:41] They just love putting it up on their shelf because they feel like the book itself is a work of art.

[01:02:46] So thank you to everybody who's done that for me.

[01:02:49] And Alicia putting it up on their bookshelves and just showing it off as a piece of art.

[01:02:55] Yeah.

[01:02:56] Did it compromise your paintings at all, Alicia?

[01:03:00] Because you said these were huge canvases.

[01:03:02] I think you said that some of them were five feet.

[01:03:05] Yes.

[01:03:05] Yes.

[01:03:06] When you had to compress it, did that compromise some of the detail or what you had initially drew out?

[01:03:13] I mean, in some ways, yes.

[01:03:15] So with the book, with the gold in the mosaic, it doesn't show off.

[01:03:21] They can't do gold shimmering in a book on a page like that.

[01:03:25] So it didn't get to show the gold, how it shines through as well.

[01:03:31] And some of it I used layering.

[01:03:33] So I intentionally, with that one as well, I have the gold shining through underneath.

[01:03:39] So it's actually like a layer underneath it.

[01:03:41] But when you see it, it's one dimensional paper.

[01:03:46] So there's things like that.

[01:03:48] But I think for the most part, they did a really good job with the coloring for it.

[01:03:52] And it came out very true to what I painted.

[01:03:55] Because I wanted the colors to stay very true.

[01:03:59] Because I used those colors for a reason.

[01:04:02] It was very intentional.

[01:04:03] So I wanted them to stay that way.

[01:04:06] Yeah, we're actually trying to get Alicia's paintings in art galleries.

[01:04:10] Oh, right on.

[01:04:11] Yeah.

[01:04:11] Just to show the actual.

[01:04:13] Yeah, the actual art pieces.

[01:04:15] Because they're all different sizes.

[01:04:16] The original piece.

[01:04:17] Yeah, the original piece.

[01:04:19] And doing a few prints as well.

[01:04:22] Five foot canvases.

[01:04:23] Six foot canvases.

[01:04:24] Yes.

[01:04:25] How long would that take you?

[01:04:27] It could take a few hours.

[01:04:29] It could take a few days.

[01:04:32] It was.

[01:04:32] But when I start painting, I don't stop.

[01:04:35] I have a bad problem of putting it down and going to bed.

[01:04:38] I will stay up.

[01:04:40] Oh, so you get in the zone.

[01:04:41] I get right in the zone and I stay there all night.

[01:04:45] And so it could take me a few days.

[01:04:48] But I will.

[01:04:49] I will spend the days on that painting.

[01:04:52] Yeah, it just depended on how I felt with it.

[01:04:54] The passion.

[01:04:55] Or if I restarted it.

[01:04:56] I did that a few times.

[01:04:57] I'd be almost done and paint over it.

[01:05:01] I could picture like a mad scientist.

[01:05:03] You just in front of the canvas.

[01:05:05] And then no food, no drinks.

[01:05:06] Someone has to slide the food under your door.

[01:05:09] And they just have to make sure you're still drinking.

[01:05:11] Because she won't get away from it.

[01:05:13] I have my tongue fully out of my mouth.

[01:05:16] I actually sometimes paint my paint.

[01:05:18] I put my paintbrush in my mouth not thinking.

[01:05:20] And I'm eating the paint.

[01:05:21] I'm like, dang it.

[01:05:21] I did it again.

[01:05:22] I'm just painting myself.

[01:05:24] I'm like, goodness.

[01:05:25] I'm horrible when I'm by myself.

[01:05:28] That's why I have my own private room.

[01:05:30] Because it is embarrassing.

[01:05:31] I'm not one of those painters you can just watch on TV.

[01:05:34] So don't watch your thing.

[01:05:35] Like Bob Ross?

[01:05:37] Yeah, I'm not a Bob Ross.

[01:05:39] I don't have the patience.

[01:05:40] Or the thought to know what I'm doing with my body while I'm painting.

[01:05:45] My brothers and I, we would watch him all the time.

[01:05:48] And it was funny.

[01:05:49] When we were in California, they even have a...

[01:05:51] It was in a small convenience store.

[01:05:53] And it was the Bob Ross positive energy drink.

[01:05:57] Oh, my God.

[01:05:59] I've never heard of that.

[01:06:01] So, yeah.

[01:06:01] You completely immerse yourself.

[01:06:04] That means you're in it to win it.

[01:06:06] I mean, there's nothing wrong with that.

[01:06:07] That I think more people need...

[01:06:09] I'm sure probably going the same thing when you're writing.

[01:06:11] You can get lost in words and translation and just in how to make the lines fill out and to

[01:06:20] convey whatever it is you're trying to express.

[01:06:22] And you can get lost in your own world, in your creative imagination and intuition.

[01:06:28] Yeah, absolutely.

[01:06:30] And I find a lot of my writing is like when I'm quiet and alone is the best.

[01:06:37] At night, when everybody's sleeping, I just...

[01:06:41] And for me, it's like in between...

[01:06:45] Sometimes I'll start on my phone, but sometimes I go back to that pen and paper.

[01:06:50] That visceral feeling of feeling it come through my body and the pen.

[01:06:56] I grew up in that generation of doing things on paper.

[01:07:00] And so, for me, I truly believe that the way that our brains developed before we were in front of computers,

[01:07:09] we would do our thinking with our head down.

[01:07:12] Right?

[01:07:13] Head down and pen to the paper.

[01:07:15] And so, I'm very much an old school pen to the paper type person.

[01:07:21] Not with my laptop.

[01:07:23] Not with my phone.

[01:07:25] But I really think it's just the way I grew up and the way my brain's been developed.

[01:07:28] Because I know younger generation, it's more difficult for them to think if they're not facing forward in front of a computer.

[01:07:36] So, yeah, old school, late at night, notebook, pen to the paper.

[01:07:42] Yeah.

[01:07:42] While Alicia's in a room, eating her paintbrush.

[01:07:46] Eating her paintbrush.

[01:07:47] In solitude and quietness, that's where all the magic happens,

[01:07:52] is in that solitude and quiet space.

[01:07:54] Like, if we give ourselves that time.

[01:07:56] I mean, even the old, all the old texts and the old stories,

[01:07:59] we can get into different religions.

[01:08:01] And in the beginning, when the worlds were created, it was in complete darkness.

[01:08:06] And that's when the creation happens.

[01:08:08] It was in that silence and that nothingness.

[01:08:10] And that's when all the things started to come to be,

[01:08:12] from the Christian story to even Hinduism.

[01:08:16] And just all of these stories about that total silence or blackness.

[01:08:21] But from that, that's when everything comes.

[01:08:24] Universes were created and the landscapes were formed and people were brought into being,

[01:08:30] whatever your belief is or however you feel about it.

[01:08:33] But those stories, they always allude to the fact that in that quietness and darkness is when things started to happen.

[01:08:39] And if we allow ourselves to do that, that's when the subconscious and that quietness,

[01:08:45] all of the imagination and the creativity and the intuition starts to speak in symbols and words.

[01:08:52] And it can really express itself through us if we allow it.

[01:08:57] Yeah, I find to, if I'm in overworked, if I'm feeling quite stressed or just in the thick of it when it comes to work,

[01:09:07] I find it's more difficult for me to find those moments of quiet and calm where I could really have the ideas flow.

[01:09:17] So I find that I have to find opportunities to really get to a place where I am feeling well and healthy.

[01:09:26] And really creating that space mentally is so important.

[01:09:31] Because in that, in the motion of the mundane or in the motion of our lives,

[01:09:37] we can sometimes get put in this autopilot mode.

[01:09:41] Yeah.

[01:09:42] And we have to find ways to ground ourselves.

[01:09:45] And I do do a lot of that through just walking or just listening to music, talking with Alicia.

[01:09:57] But it can be a bit of a challenge sometimes, especially because when you're working,

[01:10:03] and Alicia and I both work full time, you know, life gets busy.

[01:10:06] Yeah.

[01:10:08] Yeah.

[01:10:08] Life gets busy, but it's no excuse.

[01:10:10] And we really hope to encourage people to find your creativity and find what's your outlet.

[01:10:16] You know, it's very important to have something like that for our overall wellness, whatever it is.

[01:10:22] If it's drawing, pottery, knitting, hiking, hiking.

[01:10:28] Quotting.

[01:10:29] How do you say it, Els?

[01:10:30] How do you have it?

[01:10:31] I don't know.

[01:10:32] Going out adventuring, you know, going out on a boat, four-wheeling.

[01:10:36] Yeah.

[01:10:37] Just find your outlet and your creativity.

[01:10:39] Life is more than work.

[01:10:43] And I'm so grateful for this book because there's a point in time in my life where a lot of my life centered around work.

[01:10:50] And this is a gift to myself because it really creates space for me and an opportunity for me to be Gwen and to share and to find peace.

[01:11:01] And so that in itself is the best thing.

[01:11:05] And the biggest gift for me was just to find that for myself because I am a selfless person.

[01:11:13] I do a lot for others and it was a wonderful opportunity.

[01:11:16] I'm so proud of myself to finally say, you know, like this is for Gwen and this is for you, Alicia.

[01:11:22] You know, and we're going to keep doing it.

[01:11:25] That's a good way to bring the balance.

[01:11:27] Like you talked about before we were recording that balance, like that middle ground.

[01:11:31] You know, you have work, you have family or whatever your situation is.

[01:11:35] A lot of times we're pulled in so many different directions.

[01:11:37] But to get back to something, to ground yourself to something that you find enjoyment in, that brings you a sense of purpose, brings you a peace of mind.

[01:11:45] And it helps you get back in touch with yourself and who you are and to be able to also fit that into the equation, to have that outlet and to have that in your life.

[01:11:57] Something, whatever it is, that's a good way to balance out the way that life can sometimes be a bit chaotic and on the go, go, go.

[01:12:04] Absolutely.

[01:12:05] And like I commend you, Richard, for being that story facilitator.

[01:12:10] You know, you have found your outlet and I'm sure it's had such a positive impact in your life.

[01:12:19] I can tell you really enjoy doing this.

[01:12:22] Yeah.

[01:12:23] Yeah.

[01:12:23] Thank you for saying that, Gwen.

[01:12:24] I appreciate it.

[01:12:25] And it is.

[01:12:26] And that's why it spoke to me when you brought it up about work, being busy, working full time and then having this book.

[01:12:32] And the book was a good way for you to ground yourself and to get back into something where I'm back to who I am.

[01:12:38] I'm getting back to the root of it all.

[01:12:40] I'm getting back to the source, to my essence.

[01:12:42] And so it was a way to help you and to help both of you get back to that in the midst of just living and having to deal with the obligations and the responsibilities that we have.

[01:12:53] And it's the same thing with me with doing this work and everything.

[01:12:58] And even if sometimes work, whatever you're doing, if people are making ends meet and sometimes they aren't in a position to say, yeah, I love my job.

[01:13:06] I love doing what I'm doing.

[01:13:08] But maybe you're working, you're making a paycheck and you're able to provide the necessities and the securities in your life.

[01:13:15] But you can maybe you're not 100 percent in love or enthused about what you're doing.

[01:13:21] But if you can balance that off with like, say, for instance, the project that you involved yourself with, the things that you're doing or myself with this podcast.

[01:13:30] And this is something that's meaningful to me, whether I get a paycheck from it or not, but just the connections, the interactions and to be able to share these experiences with other people.

[01:13:40] For me, that brings joy.

[01:13:43] That brings joy.

[01:13:44] That brings meaning.

[01:13:44] That lights me up.

[01:13:45] That excites me and that motivates me.

[01:13:47] And so to have that balance, even if you may not be 100 percent enthusiastic or excited about what it is you're doing.

[01:13:56] Yes, absolutely.

[01:13:58] And we have to have that balance.

[01:14:00] And if we're not always balanced, but it just reminds me of Einstein's quote, like life is like a bicycle.

[01:14:08] To keep yourself balanced, you just have to keep moving forward.

[01:14:12] Right.

[01:14:12] Like forward in the passions you have, move forward in the things that make you happy.

[01:14:18] Because, yeah, life can get can get sometimes a little bit rough in the mundane of work.

[01:14:25] And I'm very lucky.

[01:14:27] I do love my work, but it still takes a lot of me to show up every day for my students.

[01:14:34] So I need to I need to fill my cup to be able to pour into other people's cup.

[01:14:41] Yeah.

[01:14:42] Yeah.

[01:14:42] Exactly.

[01:14:43] That's right.

[01:14:44] And by doing that, your cup will continue to overflow.

[01:14:48] That's right.

[01:14:49] Yeah.

[01:14:50] As you're being of service to other people.

[01:14:52] But if you hold that in and you just keep it to yourself, then eventually that's going to it's going to pour out dry and there's not going to be any more refills because you're not doing anything with it.

[01:15:00] Yeah.

[01:15:01] You know, you can both answer it in your own way.

[01:15:04] But Alicia and Gwen, what is or whoever wants to answer first?

[01:15:08] Because you both are creative spirits.

[01:15:10] And so how important is art to you or what does it mean to you?

[01:15:17] It's hard to define it and explain it because art brings out emotion.

[01:15:22] Yeah.

[01:15:23] It brings out emotion.

[01:15:25] So for me, it's it helps if you're going through a hard time.

[01:15:29] It helps.

[01:15:30] And I don't just mean painting anything.

[01:15:32] Music.

[01:15:33] You listen to a song when you're struggling and the song hits you and you listen to it over and over.

[01:15:40] Movies is an art, right?

[01:15:41] You watch that to relax at the end of the day.

[01:15:44] You're in a hospital.

[01:15:45] They even use color in hospitals to help keep patients more calm and art as well to help help them see the beauty because you're in a hospital room.

[01:15:56] It's nice to see something other than that.

[01:15:58] It makes it takes your mind other places.

[01:16:00] It helps your mind to think and process.

[01:16:02] I think art is very important, very influential, and people don't realize how influenced their life is by art.

[01:16:10] And it can help you get through something tough.

[01:16:13] It can help you see a different perspective.

[01:16:15] It can be very happy and exciting.

[01:16:20] And there's so much to it.

[01:16:22] So that's how I see art.

[01:16:24] It's all over.

[01:16:25] It's everywhere you look.

[01:16:27] There's art in everything.

[01:16:28] Yeah, and I've always saw it as a medium for storytelling.

[01:16:32] Like my favorite, I said this before, my favorite courses in college, and I also took them in university, were art history.

[01:16:38] Learning about the art during the Renaissance and learning about the stories and the history that's told behind a lot of the artwork.

[01:16:48] And also the stories of the artists themselves behind the artwork.

[01:16:52] And I always found the art so fascinating when my teacher would tell us the story behind it, whether it was the historical context and even the artists themselves.

[01:17:05] Just the stories were so fascinating.

[01:17:07] And I always find that, for me, it tells a story.

[01:17:11] And I hope that we can continue to create things that have meaning behind it.

[01:17:18] Because the stories were just so fascinating.

[01:17:21] It was such hard courses to take.

[01:17:24] I remember the textbook was like almost a thousand pages.

[01:17:28] And there was so much memorization.

[01:17:30] And I'd have to memorize the title and the time period and the artist and all of these things.

[01:17:39] But I took the course because I just absolutely loved hearing the stories.

[01:17:44] And I did well in them.

[01:17:46] And I'm just so, not the best in all the other ones, but did well in those ones.

[01:17:50] Not the education courses, the art history ones.

[01:17:53] And I can't even draw a dog with four legs.

[01:17:56] You know, so my appreciation for art came from having the opportunity to learn about the history of art through all of the eras.

[01:18:07] And I just, I find it so fascinating.

[01:18:11] And the storytelling behind it is so fascinating.

[01:18:14] And I hope as we move forward with contemporary art, we keep doing that.

[01:18:19] We keep telling those stories.

[01:18:21] Do you have any favorite authors or poets, Gwen?

[01:18:25] There's a Canadian poet.

[01:18:27] Her name is Najwa Zebian.

[01:18:29] She wrote a book, Mind Platter, a poetry book.

[01:18:33] I find that book very inspiring.

[01:18:35] I like the name of that, Mind Platter.

[01:18:36] Yeah, she's a beautiful book.

[01:18:39] And she's got many others.

[01:18:41] And I find it, another one, The Nectar of Pain, beautiful.

[01:18:45] Her writing is phenomenal.

[01:18:47] She's also an educator.

[01:18:49] So shout out to Najwa, fellow Canadian.

[01:18:53] I was asked this the other day about my favorite book.

[01:18:57] And I had said that my favorite book is Night by Elie Wiesel.

[01:19:01] And I read that book when I was very young.

[01:19:04] And it just has always stuck with me.

[01:19:06] It's like less than 100 pages.

[01:19:08] It's Elie Wiesel's story about surviving the Holocaust as a young man.

[01:19:14] And again, very short story, but incredibly impactful with a message to the world that rattles me.

[01:19:23] It makes me think about the message.

[01:19:25] And I always go back and reread it because I think it's a beautiful, powerful book.

[01:19:30] And I remember thinking that after reading that book, that storytelling can change the world.

[01:19:37] I really felt that.

[01:19:38] Like telling your truth and sharing your truth can really change the world.

[01:19:42] And he did win a Nobel Peace Prize for that.

[01:19:45] So, yeah, I love the narrative artists.

[01:19:49] I do.

[01:19:49] The people that tell the stories.

[01:19:51] Alicia, you have any favorite painters or illustrators or anyone besides Bob Ross that was truly inspiring for you?

[01:20:02] Don't just have credit, Bob Ross.

[01:20:04] That was the man.

[01:20:05] I'm a fan to this day.

[01:20:09] Yeah.

[01:20:10] Yeah.

[01:20:10] He was obviously my original inspiration because watching Bob Ross and just getting to sit there and paint.

[01:20:17] I mean, I could say so many famous painters.

[01:20:21] There's so many artists out there who are incredible.

[01:20:24] But to be honest with you, one that actually inspired me the most was actually my mother.

[01:20:31] She's not actively an artist.

[01:20:32] She doesn't usually do it, but she's done a few things.

[01:20:35] And when she does them, it's so amazing.

[01:20:38] And just to see how creative she is.

[01:20:42] And I think I get my creativity from her.

[01:20:44] Definitely.

[01:20:44] When I was little, that's what inspired me to try it.

[01:20:48] I was like, well, she could do that.

[01:20:49] And it's really cool.

[01:20:50] Like she painted a dragon on the wall.

[01:20:52] Like, that's really amazing.

[01:20:53] I could paint something.

[01:20:55] So I thought seeing that from her, it inspired me as a kid.

[01:21:00] And ever since then, it's just been a really big passion of mine, something I love doing.

[01:21:05] And I'd like to credit that to her.

[01:21:07] That just brings back the fact that you said you were inspired by that and said she did it.

[01:21:12] I can do that also.

[01:21:13] And the same thing with hearing stories of like we're talking about narrating and storytelling

[01:21:18] and to hear stories from people that have been through something or done something.

[01:21:23] And for whatever reason before that, you thought that that was completely out of your reach.

[01:21:27] But then you hear it from somebody else, maybe someone who's just like you, an ordinary person,

[01:21:33] you know, dealing with life as they are.

[01:21:35] And you say, they did it.

[01:21:36] Why can't I?

[01:21:37] And you start seeing the potential within yourself.

[01:21:42] Yeah.

[01:21:43] And I had a small community.

[01:21:45] So there was a few seniors in my town that also kind of showed me different ways to paint.

[01:21:51] And when I was really little, because it was and it was a really fun experience for me.

[01:21:56] I think I was the only kid in that entire group.

[01:21:58] It was a group full of like 60.

[01:22:04] Very much.

[01:22:05] I was the only kid like, yeah, teach me.

[01:22:07] I want to know how to do this.

[01:22:08] Yeah.

[01:22:09] So, yeah, they were, they were also very inspiring because they were painting their whole lives.

[01:22:14] And they showed me so much as a little kid.

[01:22:18] And I've taken that into adulthood.

[01:22:19] Like I've never forgot some of the stuff that they showed me.

[01:22:23] And it was, it was fun.

[01:22:25] Wow.

[01:22:25] That's pretty cool that it stuck with you.

[01:22:27] I mean, that means that it was a part of you and it was in you.

[01:22:30] If it wasn't going anywhere, whether you try to shake it or not.

[01:22:33] I don't know if you had your times when you kind of got away from it.

[01:22:37] You know, there are some times when we stop doing something that we love and then we pick it back up like an old fling.

[01:22:42] And it's like as if we never left.

[01:22:44] And oh, yeah, this is what I've been missing.

[01:22:46] But yeah, it sounds like it was always a part of you.

[01:22:50] Yeah, I noticed too when I was a lifeguard for a while there and I taught lessons and stuff.

[01:22:55] And you don't know what kids take with them.

[01:22:57] You really don't.

[01:22:58] Like I took that with me into adulthood.

[01:22:59] And then there's some kids, which is embarrassing for me to say this now, are adults that I taught lessons to.

[01:23:06] But they came to me and they're like, oh, I remember when you used to talk to us when we were younger.

[01:23:10] And you really helped me with this one thing.

[01:23:11] And I was like, I don't remember that conversation.

[01:23:14] But it stood out so much for them.

[01:23:16] And it's something they always kept with them and always remembered.

[01:23:20] And they're like, I never forgot.

[01:23:21] And it's something that was just an passing moment to me.

[01:23:24] I didn't even think about it.

[01:23:26] But it had an impact on them.

[01:23:28] So it's like what you say, you never know what you say or what you do, how it's going to impact people.

[01:23:33] So it's always good to share that positivity and bring that out.

[01:23:36] Because you never know how it could positively impact somebody's life.

[01:23:40] Yeah, absolutely.

[01:23:41] Words matter.

[01:23:42] Yes.

[01:23:42] They do.

[01:23:43] And if my grade eight teacher didn't validate my poem, that's just the energy boost and the confidence just to keep writing.

[01:23:52] And so just one teacher noticing one time made a difference for me.

[01:23:57] Yeah.

[01:23:58] I don't know if you two have heard of that.

[01:24:00] They say you can even do it yourself and experiment with it.

[01:24:03] But you hear these stories of people, even in classrooms, they did it as a science project or something where you have a plant.

[01:24:10] And then one plant you're speaking bad about.

[01:24:12] You're calling it names and everything under the sun that's negative.

[01:24:15] And then you have another plant that you're speaking positive and love and you're giving it a good reinforcement.

[01:24:21] And then that one plant that you're just giving every curse word under the sun to ends up whittling away.

[01:24:28] And the one that you're speaking positivity to, this one grows and blossoms and it flourishes.

[01:24:35] I don't know if you heard of people experimenting with that and talking stories about their own classrooms doing this and science projects and things.

[01:24:44] I've never done it myself, but I think that there's some truth to that.

[01:24:48] There is.

[01:24:48] I mean, we know that as a fact, just from growing up, you can be in a household.

[01:24:53] And if you come under the household of the mother or father and they're speaking down on you and telling you about everything that you can't do and what you are and what you aren't.

[01:25:04] And you're going to grow up and you're going to wear that bag is with you and you're going to have doubts in yourself.

[01:25:08] You're going to have a limiting belief about a lot of things that you can do.

[01:25:12] And it takes a lot of time and undoing to change your self-esteem and your self-words.

[01:25:21] So there really is a lot of truth when it comes to the power of words and how impactful they can be to someone.

[01:25:28] Yeah.

[01:25:28] And that's why this book, we hope that the words stir something in you, create some connection with yourself, with other people.

[01:25:37] Because at the end of the day, we're here to try to make connections.

[01:25:42] We're here also to build community.

[01:25:45] And for us, I 100% agree with you, Richard.

[01:25:49] Our words matter.

[01:25:50] Our actions matter.

[01:25:52] And through this experience, I've learned it to be so true.

[01:25:57] You know, the words we share have mattered with people.

[01:26:01] And we just hope to continue to do it in the future.

[01:26:04] Because that's what we plan to do.

[01:26:07] We're going to do our next book.

[01:26:09] And hopefully when we finish it, we'll reach out again and we can share the new one with you.

[01:26:15] Yes.

[01:26:16] Oh, yes.

[01:26:17] Yes, I'd love it.

[01:26:18] And I'm really looking forward to reading the rest of these poems and then looking at all of your paintings, Alicia.

[01:26:24] This sounds like a wonderful project and what I've already read.

[01:26:29] I was digging all the way because I said this resonates with me all the way.

[01:26:35] And in hearing the process behind it, all of the intricate details that you were fleshing out and brainstorming and the heart, the spirit and the soul behind it, that makes it all the more better.

[01:26:50] And yeah, I'm sure people, well, you already know from the story.

[01:26:54] The responses from those that have touched it, seen it, read it, that this is something that is meaningful and it hit home for them.

[01:27:02] So the proof is in the pudding.

[01:27:04] It really is.

[01:27:05] The proof is in the pudding.

[01:27:07] And, you know, I'm glad that we were able to have this.

[01:27:12] Like I said, this is the first time that I had a conversation, a three-way conversation.

[01:27:16] But it was great that you were both able to take time out of the day, like we said earlier, just so we could have this conversation.

[01:27:23] You're both busy in your own lives.

[01:27:26] And just to separate a little bit of time so we can have a conversation and you could talk about something that's meaningful to you and something that is very dear to you and a piece of your heart and share it with others.

[01:27:38] And yeah, thank you so much for your time.

[01:27:43] Yeah, as we get ready to wind down, do you have any final words or anything that you would like to leave off with?

[01:27:51] Yes, please check it out.

[01:28:05] Thank you, Alicia.

[01:28:23] I'll leave it with that.

[01:28:24] Yeah.

[01:28:25] And I just want to leave people with a happy new year.

[01:28:28] Create.

[01:28:29] I challenge everybody to find something for themselves in the new year that is meaningful and fills your cup and something that's really about you and brings you back to finding and celebrating your authentic self.

[01:28:45] So my best wishes to everybody in 2025.

[01:28:49] And also happy new year to you, Richard.

[01:28:51] All the best in 2020.

[01:28:53] Yes.

[01:28:53] Happy new year.

[01:28:54] Happy holidays.

[01:28:55] Thank you so much, Alicia.

[01:28:57] Gwen.

[01:28:58] Yes, happy holidays.

[01:28:59] I appreciate both of your time.

[01:29:00] And I commend you again for doing what you're doing.

[01:29:03] Keep that good spirit behind it, that good integrity behind it.

[01:29:07] And I'm sure that it's going to be impactful for everybody that sits in front of it, looks at it, touches it, sees it, and experiences it for themselves.

[01:29:16] Because this is really, really what the world needs more of.

[01:29:20] So thank you so much for doing the good work.

[01:29:22] Keep up the great, great work.

[01:29:25] Thank you so much.

[01:29:27] Thank you, Richard.

[01:29:28] Pleasure to talk to you.

[01:29:29] A big thank you once again to both Alicia and Gwen for sharing some of their creative journey with us.

[01:29:39] The backstories and everything involved with the few of the poems and the experiences that were shared through art, through painting, through poetry, through written verse.

[01:29:50] And how it was impactful, how it was meaningful for you, for the families involved.

[01:29:55] Something I respected and recognized almost immediately was the fact that I can tell this project came from a sincere place.

[01:30:03] It was genuine.

[01:30:04] It was authentic.

[01:30:06] And they were treating it with integrity from the way that, the meticulous way that they worked out the project.

[01:30:13] Alicia with the certain colors, very mindful and intentful with the colors that she used to express an emotion or an experience.

[01:30:22] And Gwen also with the way every line was couched and the way that the poems were sequenced to take us, the reader, on a journey.

[01:30:31] Exploring all of the shades, shapes, tones, codes that involves human nature.

[01:30:37] And like the both of them said, they're looking to connect to share more experiences.

[01:30:41] So if you're interested, you can reach out to them.

[01:30:44] All of the information will be in the show notes where you can purchase their book, The Canvas of Life, and also where to find them on social media.

[01:30:52] Again, a big, big thank you to both Alicia and Gwen.

[01:30:57] Stay true to yourself.

[01:30:59] Keep doing a good deed.

[01:31:00] Stand on integrity and on your moral code.

[01:31:03] All the best to you and your endeavors.

[01:31:06] You are giants amongst us.

[01:31:09] And of course, you listening right now.

[01:31:12] Thank you for having an open ear and open heart.

[01:31:15] And if you want to add to the conversation, you can check out the website, giantsamongstus.org.

[01:31:22] That is giantsamongstus.org.

[01:31:26] You can find us on YouTube.

[01:31:28] So either way, reach out to us.

[01:31:30] Let us know what you think about the show, how you feel about the show, any thoughts, any tips, any feedback, whatever it is.

[01:31:37] We're all ears.

[01:31:39] And as the sun begins to set over here on this side of town, if you would like to be a part of the show and share your story, or even a story of someone in your life that has impacted you in a positive way, you could always reach out to us via email.

[01:31:57] I'd be happy to connect until next time.

[01:32:01] And very soon.

[01:32:03] Peace.